Christian Nationalism? No

Started by Charles Austin, July 27, 2022, 11:00:28 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Rob Morris

Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 04:05:40 AM
The organization providing the pastoral pups, the helping hounds, the Christian canines, the preaching pooches, while recognized by the LCMS, does not appear to be specifically or solely LCMS. This is good.

Our comfort dog, recently retired, was provided through LCC. They are LCMS. Sorry to disappoint.

Charles Austin

Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Iowa-born. ELCA pastor, ordained 1967. Former journalist, The Record (Hackensack, NJ), The New York Times, Hearst News Service. English editor, Lutheran World Federation, Geneva. Parish pastor, Iowa, New York, New Jersey. Retired in Minneapolis. Giving up the "theology biz."

Dan Fienen

Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 09:42:26 AM
Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Missouri Synod people have a long history of working cooperatively with other people in humanitarian efforts. My own small congregation organized and manages a food distribution program in conjunction with Feeding America and other local (non-Lutheran) churches that distributes about 50 lbs. of food each month to around a hundred families in our area.
Pr. Daniel Fienen
LCMS

peter_speckhard

Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 10:45:35 AM
Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 09:42:26 AM
Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Missouri Synod people have a long history of working cooperatively with other people in humanitarian efforts. My own small congregation organized and manages a food distribution program in conjunction with Feeding America and other local (non-Lutheran) churches that distributes about 50 lbs. of food each month to around a hundred families in our area.
We stopped doing our own little food bank in order to cooperate with NW Indiana food bank, which goes to a different church in the region each day but has the infrastructure in place to keep track of clients and do quality control and publicity.

Matt Hummel

Charles- so considered discourse supporting 5 millennia of reason, tradition and faith is responsible for the outrage in CO. Does that mean the next time so Palestinian blows up his suicide vest on a Tel Aviv bus, we can point at you for vicious antisemitism, because you have gone on record as being opposed to some Israeli policies?

I would have said, "no, of course not." but you seem to think we should conflate things and tar with the same brush. Well OK then.
Matt Hummel


"The chief purpose of life, for any of us, is to increase according to our capacity our knowledge of God by all means we have, and to be moved by it to praise and thanks."

― J.R.R. Tolkien

Dan Fienen

Quote from: peter_speckhard on November 21, 2022, 10:55:25 AM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 10:45:35 AM
Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 09:42:26 AM
Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Missouri Synod people have a long history of working cooperatively with other people in humanitarian efforts. My own small congregation organized and manages a food distribution program in conjunction with Feeding America and other local (non-Lutheran) churches that distributes about 50 lbs. of food each month to around a hundred families in our area.
We stopped doing our own little food bank in order to cooperate with NW Indiana food bank, which goes to a different church in the region each day but has the infrastructure in place to keep track of clients and do quality control and publicity.
In previous churches the local church cooperated with other churches in the area with a community food bank. We do not have the facilities to store and distribute food so we participate in the Feeding America mobile food pantry program. We get a truck load of food on a specified day each month, divide it up and distribute it to families who drive up for the food and at the end of the distribution give any food left over to another food pantry in the area. There are a variety of ways to host a food pantry program. Blessings on your efforts.
Pr. Daniel Fienen
LCMS

DCharlton

Quote from: Matt Hummel on November 21, 2022, 10:56:10 AM
Charles- so considered discourse supporting 5 millennia of reason, tradition and faith is responsible for the outrage in CO. Does that mean the next time so Palestinian blows up his suicide vest on a Tel Aviv bus, we can point at you for vicious antisemitism, because you have gone on record as being opposed to some Israeli policies?

I would have said, "no, of course not." but you seem to think we should conflate things and tar with the same brush. Well OK then.

That brings back memories, Matt.  When the Pulse Nightclub massacre happened, the bishop in the Florida-Bahamas Synod at the time urged us not to blame our Muslim neighbors for the acts of one depraved individual.  However, he then went on to say it would be okay to blame proponents of traditional marriage and gun rights. 
David Charlton  

Was Algul Siento a divinity school?

Brian Stoffregen

Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 11:38:56 AM
Quote from: peter_speckhard on November 21, 2022, 10:55:25 AM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 10:45:35 AM
Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 09:42:26 AM
Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Missouri Synod people have a long history of working cooperatively with other people in humanitarian efforts. My own small congregation organized and manages a food distribution program in conjunction with Feeding America and other local (non-Lutheran) churches that distributes about 50 lbs. of food each month to around a hundred families in our area.
We stopped doing our own little food bank in order to cooperate with NW Indiana food bank, which goes to a different church in the region each day but has the infrastructure in place to keep track of clients and do quality control and publicity.
In previous churches the local church cooperated with other churches in the area with a community food bank. We do not have the facilities to store and distribute food so we participate in the Feeding America mobile food pantry program. We get a truck load of food on a specified day each month, divide it up and distribute it to families who drive up for the food and at the end of the distribution give any food left over to another food pantry in the area. There are a variety of ways to host a food pantry program. Blessings on your efforts.


So, feeding the hungry is an activity where the LCMS can be seen as united with other folks, but when it is worshiping our God, they don't want to be seen as being united with other Christians. OK. Got it.
I flunked retirement. Serving as a part-time interim in Ferndale, WA.

peter_speckhard

Quote from: Brian Stoffregen on November 21, 2022, 12:02:50 PM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 11:38:56 AM
Quote from: peter_speckhard on November 21, 2022, 10:55:25 AM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 10:45:35 AM
Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 09:42:26 AM
Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Missouri Synod people have a long history of working cooperatively with other people in humanitarian efforts. My own small congregation organized and manages a food distribution program in conjunction with Feeding America and other local (non-Lutheran) churches that distributes about 50 lbs. of food each month to around a hundred families in our area.
We stopped doing our own little food bank in order to cooperate with NW Indiana food bank, which goes to a different church in the region each day but has the infrastructure in place to keep track of clients and do quality control and publicity.
In previous churches the local church cooperated with other churches in the area with a community food bank. We do not have the facilities to store and distribute food so we participate in the Feeding America mobile food pantry program. We get a truck load of food on a specified day each month, divide it up and distribute it to families who drive up for the food and at the end of the distribution give any food left over to another food pantry in the area. There are a variety of ways to host a food pantry program. Blessings on your efforts.


So, feeding the hungry is an activity where the LCMS can be seen as united with other folks, but when it is worshiping our God, they don't want to be seen as being united with other Christians. OK. Got it.
Yes. I'll be glad to serve up soup with you. I would never let you preach or lead worship at St. Paul's.

DCharlton

Quote from: Brian Stoffregen on November 21, 2022, 12:02:50 PM
So, feeding the hungry is an activity where the LCMS can be seen as united with other folks, but when it is worshiping our God, they don't want to be seen as being united with other Christians. OK. Got it.

Well, to be fair.  In the case of the ELCA, it's not always clear which God is being worshipped.  Half of the time, I'm not sure.
David Charlton  

Was Algul Siento a divinity school?

Donald_Kirchner

Quote from: Brian Stoffregen on November 21, 2022, 12:02:50 PM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 11:38:56 AM
Quote from: peter_speckhard on November 21, 2022, 10:55:25 AM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 10:45:35 AM
Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 09:42:26 AM
Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Missouri Synod people have a long history of working cooperatively with other people in humanitarian efforts. My own small congregation organized and manages a food distribution program in conjunction with Feeding America and other local (non-Lutheran) churches that distributes about 50 lbs. of food each month to around a hundred families in our area.
We stopped doing our own little food bank in order to cooperate with NW Indiana food bank, which goes to a different church in the region each day but has the infrastructure in place to keep track of clients and do quality control and publicity.
In previous churches the local church cooperated with other churches in the area with a community food bank. We do not have the facilities to store and distribute food so we participate in the Feeding America mobile food pantry program. We get a truck load of food on a specified day each month, divide it up and distribute it to families who drive up for the food and at the end of the distribution give any food left over to another food pantry in the area. There are a variety of ways to host a food pantry program. Blessings on your efforts.


So, feeding the hungry is an activity where the LCMS can be seen as united with other folks, but when it is worshiping our God, they don't want to be seen as being united with other Christians. OK. Got it.

I deny your premise. Your God is not the Christian God because the Jesus you identify is not the Christian Jesus.
Don Kirchner

"Heaven's OK, but it's not the end of the world." Jeff Gibbs

Brian Stoffregen

Quote from: peter_speckhard on November 21, 2022, 12:13:45 PM
Quote from: Brian Stoffregen on November 21, 2022, 12:02:50 PM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 11:38:56 AM
Quote from: peter_speckhard on November 21, 2022, 10:55:25 AM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 10:45:35 AM
Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 09:42:26 AM
Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Missouri Synod people have a long history of working cooperatively with other people in humanitarian efforts. My own small congregation organized and manages a food distribution program in conjunction with Feeding America and other local (non-Lutheran) churches that distributes about 50 lbs. of food each month to around a hundred families in our area.
We stopped doing our own little food bank in order to cooperate with NW Indiana food bank, which goes to a different church in the region each day but has the infrastructure in place to keep track of clients and do quality control and publicity.
In previous churches the local church cooperated with other churches in the area with a community food bank. We do not have the facilities to store and distribute food so we participate in the Feeding America mobile food pantry program. We get a truck load of food on a specified day each month, divide it up and distribute it to families who drive up for the food and at the end of the distribution give any food left over to another food pantry in the area. There are a variety of ways to host a food pantry program. Blessings on your efforts.


So, feeding the hungry is an activity where the LCMS can be seen as united with other folks, but when it is worshiping our God, they don't want to be seen as being united with other Christians. OK. Got it.
Yes. I'll be glad to serve up soup with you. I would never let you preach or lead worship at St. Paul's.


How is serving soup to help folks different than decorating a cake? I imagine that soup servers don't discriminate by race, creed, religion, sexual orientation, or other; but cake decorators can?
I flunked retirement. Serving as a part-time interim in Ferndale, WA.

Dan Fienen

Quote from: Brian Stoffregen on November 21, 2022, 12:02:50 PM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 11:38:56 AM
Quote from: peter_speckhard on November 21, 2022, 10:55:25 AM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 10:45:35 AM
Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 09:42:26 AM
Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Missouri Synod people have a long history of working cooperatively with other people in humanitarian efforts. My own small congregation organized and manages a food distribution program in conjunction with Feeding America and other local (non-Lutheran) churches that distributes about 50 lbs. of food each month to around a hundred families in our area.
We stopped doing our own little food bank in order to cooperate with NW Indiana food bank, which goes to a different church in the region each day but has the infrastructure in place to keep track of clients and do quality control and publicity.
In previous churches the local church cooperated with other churches in the area with a community food bank. We do not have the facilities to store and distribute food so we participate in the Feeding America mobile food pantry program. We get a truck load of food on a specified day each month, divide it up and distribute it to families who drive up for the food and at the end of the distribution give any food left over to another food pantry in the area. There are a variety of ways to host a food pantry program. Blessings on your efforts.


So, feeding the hungry is an activity where the LCMS can be seen as united with other folks, but when it is worshiping our God, they don't want to be seen as being united with other Christians. OK. Got it.
Or when you're ELCA worshipping our God with the NALC.
Pr. Daniel Fienen
LCMS

peter_speckhard

Quote from: Brian Stoffregen on November 21, 2022, 12:31:32 PM
Quote from: peter_speckhard on November 21, 2022, 12:13:45 PM
Quote from: Brian Stoffregen on November 21, 2022, 12:02:50 PM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 11:38:56 AM
Quote from: peter_speckhard on November 21, 2022, 10:55:25 AM
Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 10:45:35 AM
Quote from: Charles Austin on November 21, 2022, 09:42:26 AM
Pastor Fienen:
In what way does the Lutheran Church Charities, the organization providing the K-9 Comfort Dogs, appear to not be specifically or solely LCMS?  Why do you consider that good?
Me:
There is nothing on their website saying they are a Missouri Synod organization. They are one of your RSOs. I found a reference to them, I think, in one ELCA congregation.
I would consider it good if Missouri Synod people and non-Missouri Synod people were cooperating in providing these interesting animals. I have known a few "service dogs" over the years, and I found them fine critters.
Missouri Synod people have a long history of working cooperatively with other people in humanitarian efforts. My own small congregation organized and manages a food distribution program in conjunction with Feeding America and other local (non-Lutheran) churches that distributes about 50 lbs. of food each month to around a hundred families in our area.
We stopped doing our own little food bank in order to cooperate with NW Indiana food bank, which goes to a different church in the region each day but has the infrastructure in place to keep track of clients and do quality control and publicity.
In previous churches the local church cooperated with other churches in the area with a community food bank. We do not have the facilities to store and distribute food so we participate in the Feeding America mobile food pantry program. We get a truck load of food on a specified day each month, divide it up and distribute it to families who drive up for the food and at the end of the distribution give any food left over to another food pantry in the area. There are a variety of ways to host a food pantry program. Blessings on your efforts.


So, feeding the hungry is an activity where the LCMS can be seen as united with other folks, but when it is worshiping our God, they don't want to be seen as being united with other Christians. OK. Got it.
Yes. I'll be glad to serve up soup with you. I would never let you preach or lead worship at St. Paul's.


How is serving soup to help folks different than decorating a cake? I imagine that soup servers don't discriminate by race, creed, religion, sexual orientation, or other; but cake decorators can?
I would certainly retain the right as a volunteer soup server to serve soup or not to whomever I want. More analogous to serving soup would be making my special recipe, secret, old world family soup for some occasion, which I would make or not make at my discretion. But even just serving it-- if someone declared they intended to use the soup to scald old ladies, I would not give them any. And if anyone asked me to whip up a batch of my specialty soup so they could celebrate their successful divorce or abortion, I would politely pass on the opportunity.   

Brian Stoffregen

Quote from: Dan Fienen on November 21, 2022, 12:36:02 PM
Or when you're ELCA worshipping our God with the NALC.


This view concerning clergy, I believe, comes from some misguided bishops. Although, I don't think any ELCAers are prohibited from worshiping in NALC congregations.
I flunked retirement. Serving as a part-time interim in Ferndale, WA.

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk