Started by Rev. Edward Engelbrecht, December 16, 2021, 07:53:48 AM
Quote from: Dave Likeness on December 19, 2021, 09:35:40 PMIn the CTQ January/April 2010 issue, Dr Lawrence Rast Jr.wrote an article entitled:J.A.O. Preus: Theologian, Churchman or Both?He states that the 1975 Anaheim Synodical Convention gave LCMS President Preusthe authority to declare vacant the office of any district president who should ordaina non-certified (Seminex) candidate. There were 8 DPs who ordained Seminexcandidates & President Preus only removed 4 of them. This led to an outcry from someconservatives who began efforts to find an replacement for President Preus. In the1977 convention Preus was returned to office. By the 1981 nomination cycle, Preussurprised some and refused to allow his name to stand for re-election.
Quote from: Dave Benke on December 19, 2021, 08:48:36 PMQuote from: Charles Austin on December 19, 2021, 02:48:35 PMAlso interesting would be historical profiles of certain congregations that left the LCMS during those years. I knew several, and was later interim pastor for two terms at one of them. It was one of the finest congregations I have ever served. It went to the ALC in 1976, had then came into the ELCA. Some founders of the congregation were still around and it had something of the "old Missouri" structure even well into the ELCA years. I liked it there - 2 years in one term, later almost 3 years in a second term, - and if you can imagine it - it seems the congregation liked me, although we did not always agree on things. I miss them, especially during holiday seasons.Remember that the title "Seminex" is about a seminary. The results in the field had to do with the use of a specific bylaw or convention resolution that placed district presidents who placed and ordained graduates from Seminex under suspension. When those eight (?) presidents went ahead, they were removed from office. In various districts that produced the next step, which was leaving the Missouri Synod in support of their district presidents. Two districts dramatically affected were New England and Atlantic. Not five years prior, the Atlantic District had been divided into New England, Atlantic and New Jersey. New England President Robert Riedel (a predecessor of mine at St. Peter's Brooklyn) and Atlantic District President Rudy Ressmeyer (grandson of Franz Pieper) were ousted, and 60-70 congregations left with them. The seminex graduates ordained and placed in most cases left as well, although there was a way for the congregations and pastors who didn't leave to come through that situation, I believe with an interview of some kind. My consiglieri for most of my time in the Atlantic District (ie First Vice President), Chip Froehlich, was a Seminex grad who stayed with the LCMS. Since our entire district Praesidium left the denomination, Jack Preus was left to find an interim District President somewhere else, and one of the district board pastors, Hank Koepchen, said yes. Eventually we had a district convention and elected Ron Fink to serve. The national denomination did basically nothing for us in that period - I had been elevated by circumstance to serve on the District board. We were pretty much set adrift, with every subsidized congregation remaining and all of the top membership/donation congregations leaving. Ron spent years doing triage among those of us who were left, and was a wonderful healer and consoler.Anyway, I wonder whether what happened "on the ground" is considered part of the Seminex saga. It certainly should be.Dave BenkeDave Benke
Quote from: Charles Austin on December 19, 2021, 02:48:35 PMAlso interesting would be historical profiles of certain congregations that left the LCMS during those years. I knew several, and was later interim pastor for two terms at one of them. It was one of the finest congregations I have ever served. It went to the ALC in 1976, had then came into the ELCA. Some founders of the congregation were still around and it had something of the "old Missouri" structure even well into the ELCA years. I liked it there - 2 years in one term, later almost 3 years in a second term, - and if you can imagine it - it seems the congregation liked me, although we did not always agree on things. I miss them, especially during holiday seasons.
Quote from: Terry W Culler on December 20, 2021, 09:47:45 AMit has seemed to me that whenever the LCMS elected a "conservative" president, it didn't take too long before the more "conservative" factions to turn on him. It then leaves the question of just what would satisfy the more "conservative" factions and the only thing I can think of is a split in which some would leave and some stay. That would be a great shame for all sorts of reasons but the one that stands out for me is the fact that Missouri can, because of its size, speak for conservative Lutherans in a public way which those of us in smaller denominations cannot. The ELCA gets far more public notice than even Missouri, but if Missouri were to break up again the conservative Lutherans in this country will be so fractured our positions will receive no public notice.
Quote from: Mike in Pennsylvania on December 19, 2021, 05:18:19 PMThe "slow motion schism" is still in motion, at least into the NALC, and I would suspect the LCMC as well. It's a couple of dozen churches a year, but it continues.Don't think anybody's trying to write any sort of scholarly history yet, though Mark Granquist mentions it briefly in his history of American Lutheranism.
Quote from: Charles Austin on December 20, 2021, 03:17:31 PMI heard of one church in the ELCA that withdrew last year because it wanted to call its Pastor without any input from the Synod. That is, it wanted to "hire" a pastor, whether or not that Pastor was on the ELCA roster or had synodical endorsement.