Author Topic: Seminex in Print  (Read 3818 times)

Richard Johnson

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Re: Seminex in Print
« Reply #105 on: December 21, 2021, 10:28:06 PM »
The ELCA has three interdependent expressions of "church": the congregation, the synod, and the churchwide expression. Any one of those can be called "church." Thus, when the synod is in assembly, it is church. When we talk about the call being through the agency of the church, it involves all three expressions. As an ordained pastor in the ELCA (meaning: I'm on its roster of ministers of word and sacrament,) I can preach and preside at any ELCA congregation (at their invitation, or at the request of a synod bishop) and at any congregation of our full partner church bodies (at their invitation). It is our synods who are responsible for the rostering. The synod council can remove pastors from the roster. Pastors' synodical membership gets transferred when they move to a new synod.

The bolded portion is new to me, Brian. 

New to me, too. Can you cite the constitutional provision that allows this?
I donít think Dave Benke said that. The quote feature must be messed up.

Brian said it, Dave quoted it and then said "That bolded portion is new to me, Brian."
The Rev. Richard O. Johnson, STS

Richard Johnson

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Re: Seminex in Print
« Reply #106 on: December 21, 2021, 10:34:22 PM »
Sounds as though we need a copy of the ELCA and Synod bylaws.  Nothing better for a cold winter's night than a cup of kindness and a copy of denominational bylaws.

Dave Benke

They're available online. But if you're looking for something to help you fall asleep, I recommend the bylaws of a homeowner's association.

The point is that Brian misspoke when he said "The synod council can remove pastors from the roster." They can't. And the disciplinary provision isn't really ambiguous at all. If the discipline committee calls for private censure, the bishop does it. If they determine the pastor is to be removed. he or she is simply removed. Nobody else has to approve it. The Synod Council isn't involved at all. As Chuck said, the only way the Synod Council is involved in a pastor being removed from the roster is if they fail to approve an on-leave from call status.
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Dave Benke

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Re: Seminex in Print
« Reply #107 on: December 22, 2021, 08:20:41 AM »
Sounds as though we need a copy of the ELCA and Synod bylaws.  Nothing better for a cold winter's night than a cup of kindness and a copy of denominational bylaws.

Dave Benke

They're available online. But if you're looking for something to help you fall asleep, I recommend the bylaws of a homeowner's association.

The point is that Brian misspoke when he said "The synod council can remove pastors from the roster." They can't. And the disciplinary provision isn't really ambiguous at all. If the discipline committee calls for private censure, the bishop does it. If they determine the pastor is to be removed. he or she is simply removed. Nobody else has to approve it. The Synod Council isn't involved at all. As Chuck said, the only way the Synod Council is involved in a pastor being removed from the roster is if they fail to approve an on-leave from call status.

Thanks for this, Richard -
a) spares the need to pore over those bylaws
b) makes way more sense given the power allocated to bishops in the ELCA in the last generation
c) would have made for highly contested synod council elections, which at least in my estimation are usually walk-overs and/or appointments

Dave Benke