Islamophobia

[peter_speckhard]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/canadian-school-district-cancels-speech-by-isis-rape-survivor-due-to-islamophobia-fears

This is part of the same issue we deal with regarding other topics. The attempt to control the discourse fosters distrust. Here a prizewinning author sharing a harrowing story can’t talk to the schools for fear it would foster Islamophobia. Setting aside that there is no similar compunction about stories of how Natives suffered at the hands of Christian missionaries, the real issue is that refusing to admit or discuss something because it might make people think a certain (about the climate, vaccines, Muslims, communism, etc.) simply informs people that you are more interested in an agenda than the truth. People lose trust in such authorities no matter much expertise they have.

[Dave Benke]

From another thread, both Cornell West and Robert George spoke from very different ends of the spectrum against restrictions on free speech on college campuses and in general lauding freedom of speech as one of the treasures of our constitutional democracy:  https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=Firing+Line+margaret+hoover+cornell+west&docid=608017062619735422&mid=DBF94D6AACD24E8BE399DBF94D6AACD24E8BE399&view=detail&FORM=VIRE

Dave Benke

[Charles Austin]

Does it occur to anyone that a speaker who has been personally and severely victimized, tortured, and raped by Islamic extremists might not be the best speaker for a gathering of school students, for some of whom this might be their first experience with Islam? Students should learn about Islam in general not at its worst.

[James S. Rustad]

The article has been updated with a statement from the Toronto District School Board.

In a statement to Fox News Digital on Sunday, the Toronto District School Board said the event is not yet canceled and Murad's book is being reviewed.

"The event has not been cancelled," spokesman Ryan Bird told Fox. "Earlier this month, an opinion that did not reflect the position of the Toronto District School Board was shared with the organizer of a book club prior to staff having an opportunity to read the book – something that is routinely done before giving them to students. Staff are currently reading the book and anticipate being able to add it to the list of titles used in the corresponding course(s) very shortly. We have apologized to Ms. Murad for this error and believe she has a powerful story to share with our students."

[Donald_Kirchner]

Does it occur to anyone that a speaker who has been personally and severely victimized, tortured, and raped by Islamic extremists might not be the best speaker for a gathering of school students, for some of whom this might be their first experience with Islam? Students should learn about Islam in general not at its worst.

No. As to your second sentence, perhaps her presentation addresses Islam in general.

[Charles Austin]

Pastor Kirchner:
… perhaps her presentation addresses Islam in general.

Me:
….and perhaps the last guy released from Guantanamo is giving speeches addressing American Justice “in general.”

[Donald_Kirchner]

Pastor Kirchner:
… perhaps her presentation addresses Islam in general.

Me:
….and perhaps the last guy released from Guantanamo is giving speeches addressing American Justice “in general.”

Right on queue, an illogical analogy.

[Pastor Ken Kimball]

Really, Pastor Austin?  Comparing someone who suffered rape under ISIS control to someone imprisoned at Guantanamo for participation in terrorism?  Moral equivalency?  Okay, you can fill in the back story of someone unjustly imprisoned at Guantanamo though they were innocent...or maybe a freedom fighter defending whatever you think they worthily defended...whatever narrative needs to be constructed equate the U.S. with Al Qaida / Taliban.   Bit of a stretch.   But I'm all for full telling of this woman's account and that of whatever Guantanamo inmate you pick.  I think the account of each person's experience and what they did as well as what was done to them would give us a fuller and fairer picture of Islam in general--and far better comparison than your equating of the two in order to dismiss this woman's account. 

[Charles Austin]

I am not making a case for the equivalency of the two situations. I’m only saying that someone who comes out of either of those experiences is not likely to speak kindly or a balanced way of the perpetrator, whether or not that balance is merited.

[peter_speckhard]

I am not making a case for the equivalency of the two situations. I’m only saying that someone who comes out of either of those experiences is not likely to speak kindly or a balanced way of the perpetrator, whether or not that balance is merited.

I don’t think anyone is suggesting that this person’s presentation be the extent of what is taught about Islam in the schools. It is not her job to balance anything. That is the school’s job, and she perspective is one part of it. Furthermore, the school should not much care if the students come away with a positive or negative view of Islam.

[Donald_Kirchner]

I am not making a case for the equivalency of the two situations.

And then goes on to attempt a case for an equivalency.   

 

I’m only saying that someone who comes out of either of those experiences is not likely to speak kindly or a balanced way of the perpetrator, whether or not that balance is merited.

[Charles Austin]

Missed it again, Pastor Kirchner.
Let me be more clear.
What the woman experienced under Islamic extremism was unjust, terrible and an abomination.
What prisoners at Guantanamo was let us stipulate, just, not as bad as being tortured and raped and not an abomination.
STILL, neither the woman nor the prisoners of the US are likely to speak in an objective way about who gave them those experiences nor are they likely to have a balanced view of the belief and/or governmental system under which they had those experiences.
Good grief, we have to strain hard here for some common sense!

[peter_speckhard]

Missed it again, Pastor Kirchner.
Let me be more clear.
What the woman experienced under Islamic extremism was unjust, terrible and an abomination.
What prisoners at Guantanamo was let us stipulate, just, not as bad as being tortured and raped and not an abomination.
STILL, neither the woman nor the prisoners of the US are likely to speak in an objective way about who gave them those experiences nor are they likely to have a balanced view of the belief and/or governmental system under which they had those experiences.
Good grief, we have to strain hard here for some common sense!

But again, no guest speaker is brought in to speak in an objective way. A textbook can attempt that. The problem here is that the schools have decided what the children should think about Islam and nixed a speaker who wouldn’t further that goal.

On the issue of schools in the US, people who objected to Toni Morrison novels for featuring pornographic scenes lost that particular battle. She is an award winning novelist, so Hugh school kids can be exposed to her work even if some of it requires context or guidance. This speaker is also a international, award winning writer and speaker. So why the fear of kids hearing her story?

[Charles Austin]

Maybe I wasn't clear on the whole of the matter. I personally, me, myself, believe that Nadia Murad should speak anywhere she wants to speak and I have no doubt she has many invitations. Good.
But I also understand why a school board or local area might decide she is not an appropriate speaker for that crowd.
But the update says she may speak to the Toronto students, so perhaps Fox news was too eager to find another example of "cancel culture."

[Brian Stoffregen]

Missed it again, Pastor Kirchner.
Let me be more clear.
What the woman experienced under Islamic extremism was unjust, terrible and an abomination.
What prisoners at Guantanamo was let us stipulate, just, not as bad as being tortured and raped and not an abomination.
STILL, neither the woman nor the prisoners of the US are likely to speak in an objective way about who gave them those experiences nor are they likely to have a balanced view of the belief and/or governmental system under which they had those experiences.
Good grief, we have to strain hard here for some common sense!

But again, no guest speaker is brought in to speak in an objective way. A textbook can attempt that. The problem here is that the schools have decided what the children should think about Islam and nixed a speaker who wouldn’t further that goal.

On the issue of schools in the US, people who objected to Toni Morrison novels for featuring pornographic scenes lost that particular battle. She is an award winning novelist, so Hugh school kids can be exposed to her work even if some of it requires context or guidance. This speaker is also a international, award winning writer and speaker. So why the fear of kids hearing her story?

I think I should start a teaching tour among Lutheran congregation about my and my friends’ experiences with Missouri Synod Lutherans. I’m sure I could conduct myself as an expert and present them in the worst possible light and let others try and correct any biased, but true statements I might make about that denomination.