Author Topic: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel  (Read 3028 times)

George Rahn

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #30 on: March 24, 2021, 05:32:30 PM »
If all of them (disciples) forsook Jesus and fled (Mark 14:50), and even the women eventually leave the empty tomb (literally in the Greek) with trauma and ecstasy, (no one says anything to anyone because they were/are afraid), the only ones who have not abandoned Jesus at the end of the Gospel are the man still in the tomb, an otherwise empty tomb, and then also, you yourself, the reader.  I guess with the Gospel still around today someone went to Galilee and let the word out!  Someone went to Galilee.  Isn’t that a wonderful thing?
« Last Edit: March 24, 2021, 05:37:12 PM by George Rahn »

Brian Stoffregen

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #31 on: March 24, 2021, 05:34:09 PM »

Note: νεανίσκος, the word for “young man” who is dressed in white (16:5), is the same word used for the “young man” in the garden who is wearing only in linen cloth until he flees naked (14:51-52). These are the only two instances of this word in Mark.


One interpretation of these two (connected?) passages is that the young man represents all the baptized. As Jesus is dying the young man runs away leaving his σινδων behind. σινδων is normally the word used for a burial garment. We are buried with Jesus but trade the burial garment for the white robe of the baptized who are raised with him. Such an interpretation (dying/rising) is consonant with Romans 6 and the νεανίσκος with the new born infants of I Peter 2. It is perfect for an Easter Vigil where baptisms are administered.


σινδών is the word used for the (linen) cloth used for wrapping Jesus' body (Mt 27:59; Mk 15:46; Lu 23:53). It's not really a word that means "burial garment," but refers to a "good quality linen cloth" or a "garment made of this cloth." It's used with that sense in the LXX (Jd 14:12, 13; Pr 31:24). In addition, the Hebrew word it replaces, סָדִין, refers to an undergarment worn next to the body made of linen.


Using νεανίσκος for "newborn infants" is going beyond its definition. BDAG indicate that it refers to a young man from about the ages of 24-40. Lowe & Nida state: "a young man beyond the age of puberty, but normally before marriage."


1 Peter 2:2 uses ἀρτιγέννητα βρέφη for "newborn infants". βρέφος refers to children from before birth ("fetus") through the nursing stage ("baby, infant").


Perhaps the closer traditional liturgical connection is when the baptized were naked and put on a white garment when coming out of the water to the new life in Christ.

"The church … had made us like ill-taught piano students; we play our songs, but we never really hear them, because our main concern is not to make music, but but to avoid some flub that will get us in dutch." [Robert Capon, _Between Noon and Three_, p. 148]

George Rahn

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #32 on: March 24, 2021, 05:39:54 PM »

Note: νεανίσκος, the word for “young man” who is dressed in white (16:5), is the same word used for the “young man” in the garden who is wearing only in linen cloth until he flees naked (14:51-52). These are the only two instances of this word in Mark.


One interpretation of these two (connected?) passages is that the young man represents all the baptized. As Jesus is dying the young man runs away leaving his σινδων behind. σινδων is normally the word used for a burial garment. We are buried with Jesus but trade the burial garment for the white robe of the baptized who are raised with him. Such an interpretation (dying/rising) is consonant with Romans 6 and the νεανίσκος with the new born infants of I Peter 2. It is perfect for an Easter Vigil where baptisms are administered.


σινδών is the word used for the (linen) cloth used for wrapping Jesus' body (Mt 27:59; Mk 15:46; Lu 23:53). It's not really a word that means "burial garment," but refers to a "good quality linen cloth" or a "garment made of this cloth." It's used with that sense in the LXX (Jd 14:12, 13; Pr 31:24). In addition, the Hebrew word it replaces, סָדִין, refers to an undergarment worn next to the body made of linen.


Using νεανίσκος for "newborn infants" is going beyond its definition. BDAG indicate that it refers to a young man from about the ages of 24-40. Lowe & Nida state: "a young man beyond the age of puberty, but normally before marriage."


1 Peter 2:2 uses ἀρτιγέννητα βρέφη for "newborn infants". βρέφος refers to children from before birth ("fetus") through the nursing stage ("baby, infant").


Perhaps the closer traditional liturgical connection is when the baptized were naked and put on a white garment when coming out of the water to the new life in Christ.

Nice connection here.  Isn’t it odd after all these years the rawness of this historical event continues to mystify and cause one to either scratch their head or rejoice!

Brian Stoffregen

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #33 on: March 24, 2021, 05:59:03 PM »
The Markan Gospel is THE historic reading for Easter morning in the Western Church. I am struck always by two things, but they’re different from Pr. Morlock’s.

1. The absence of any encounter with the risen Christ in that reading; instead all they’re left with is sort of the same as what we get. Some dude got up in white telling the good news that He is risen as He said!

2. The ambiguity of the ending. Did they say anything? Will we? Will fear overcome? Or will the joy and wonder of the news overcome?

Well, and add in the third:

3. The women’s worry about the stone. And God had already seen to it. Yet they worried. So do we. Over a thousand and one things that simply don’t matter once it sinks into our bones: “He is risen as He said.”

Well, and add in the fourth:

4. Yes, to Pr. Morlockk’s Galilee. Go meet Him where He has promised to be for you. For them, Galilee (though I love that He couldn’t seem to wait for that; too much joy to hold off for the journey and so the Jerusalem appearances too); for us, the Supper.


Note that both Jesus (Mt 26:32; Mk 14:28) and the messenger at the tomb (Mt 28:7; Mk 16:7) state that the risen Jesus "goes before" (προάγω) them to Galilee. Before they get to Galilee, Jesus is already there.
"The church … had made us like ill-taught piano students; we play our songs, but we never really hear them, because our main concern is not to make music, but but to avoid some flub that will get us in dutch." [Robert Capon, _Between Noon and Three_, p. 148]

peterm

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #34 on: March 24, 2021, 06:28:29 PM »
The Markan Gospel is THE historic reading for Easter morning in the Western Church. I am struck always by two things, but they’re different from Pr. Morlock’s.

1. The absence of any encounter with the risen Christ in that reading; instead all they’re left with is sort of the same as what we get. Some dude got up in white telling the good news that He is risen as He said!

2. The ambiguity of the ending. Did they say anything? Will we? Will fear overcome? Or will the joy and wonder of the news overcome?

Well, and add in the third:

3. The women’s worry about the stone. And God had already seen to it. Yet they worried. So do we. Over a thousand and one things that simply don’t matter once it sinks into our bones: “He is risen as He said.”

Well, and add in the fourth:

4. Yes, to Pr. Morlockk’s Galilee. Go meet Him where He has promised to be for you. For them, Galilee (though I love that He couldn’t seem to wait for that; too much joy to hold off for the journey and so the Jerusalem appearances too); for us, the Supper.

YES!  Someday if we ever end up in the same geographic space I would like to sit down with you and while away some time.
Rev. Peter Morlock- ELCA pastor serving two congregations in WIS

Weedon

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #35 on: March 24, 2021, 07:08:45 PM »
Pastor Morlock, that would be a joy indeed! I pray may grant it.

Dave Benke

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #36 on: March 25, 2021, 07:35:35 PM »
Here is a really insightful conversation between Richard Lischer and Will Willimon, both Duke Divinity School professors past and current (Lischer a Concordia St. Louis grad late 60sish), useful on the topic at hand, entitled "Stunned Observers":  https://www.christiancentury.org/article/interview/preaching-holy-week-middle-pandemic-again

Dave Benke

Brian Stoffregen

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #37 on: March 27, 2021, 12:55:41 PM »
In an article unrelated to our specific text, Donald Juel writes: "It is not enough to ask what a passage means; we must ask what it intends to do – or perhaps even more accurately, what we intend to do with it." ("The Strange Silence of the Bible, Interpretation, January 1997, p. 16) In an oral culture words were not so much centered on what the words mean (to readers,) but what the words do to hearers.


We should wonder what reading Mark 16:1-8 does to the people sitting in the pews. When the story ends with silence, what reactions should we expect from the people who know the story of the resurrection thousands of years later?


In that sense, I think that our audiences are much like those of Mark's: people who know the truth of the resurrection who are surprised by this ending of Mark. In fact, a short commentary on Mark by Donald Juel is called: A Master of Surprise: Mark Interpreted.
"The church … had made us like ill-taught piano students; we play our songs, but we never really hear them, because our main concern is not to make music, but but to avoid some flub that will get us in dutch." [Robert Capon, _Between Noon and Three_, p. 148]

Harvey_Mozolak

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #38 on: March 27, 2021, 01:51:20 PM »
Has it been offered here or elsewhere... a possible connection of the Messianic Secret and the short ending of Mark?  I wrote the following elsewhere in one of my mailings.

Is the ending another piece in the puzzle of the Marcian secret that Christ delivered any number of times-- “don’t tell anyone” and “don’t tell anyone until after….”   Could the so-called Messianic Secret be an applied tool used in crafting the conclusion of the Gospel?

This being the last instance of Jesus warning given one final time to be undone by his resurrection.  Well, no one to tell….  Or so someone would think if they didn’t have this manuscript in their hand or being read to them or being told to them with a loooooong pause... and know that the church is well and alive, thank you very much, Jesus!

Has anyone done any reading among NT scholars that suggests such a use of the ending’s seemingly truncated conclusion?

We are used to and enjoy secretly hidden, colorful Easter eggs, chocolate candy and once waxed, black outlined, European pysanky hidden behind the couch or in the grass and best in the crook of a backyard tree with eggs hanging like blood red and yellow sun-filled and blue as the waiting Virgin rain drops baptizing creation with hope and promise and risen love.  Blessed days of discovery ahead!   
Harvey S. Mozolak
my poetry blog is listed below:

http://lineandletterlettuce.blogspot.com

Weedon

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #39 on: March 27, 2021, 02:30:39 PM »
I think the problem of it intentionally ending there is that “gar.” I think there had to be another leaf that we’ve lost and that was supplied (probably from Peter’s preaching) with the other accounts summarized in the rest of the chapter. I think the Messianic secret is a thing of the past after the Triumphal Entry. Jesus openly proclaimed it was HIS City and He was its King. “Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord.” Mk 12:10 Or more explicitly in Lk 19:38 “Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord.” Significantly, though, he didn’t lead the crowds to storm the Praetorium but up to the Temple. He’s a King of a different kind, of course.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2021, 02:34:10 PM by Weedon »

Brian Stoffregen

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #40 on: March 27, 2021, 07:26:58 PM »
I think the problem of it intentionally ending there is that “gar.” I think there had to be another leaf that we’ve lost and that was supplied (probably from Peter’s preaching) with the other accounts summarized in the rest of the chapter. I think the Messianic secret is a thing of the past after the Triumphal Entry. Jesus openly proclaimed it was HIS City and He was its King. “Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord.” Mk 12:10 Or more explicitly in Lk 19:38 “Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord.” Significantly, though, he didn’t lead the crowds to storm the Praetorium but up to the Temple. He’s a King of a different kind, of course.


Jesus did not proclaim himself king. The crowds did. (The reference is Mark 11:10.) Crowds were often wrong about their understanding of Jesus. Could it have been the same crowd who later yelled, "Crucify him"?


I don't think that the "secret" of Jesus' identity is revealed until the centurion sees him die. That is what properly revealed him as the Son of God. That's what the disciples and the crowds couldn't get right before.
"The church … had made us like ill-taught piano students; we play our songs, but we never really hear them, because our main concern is not to make music, but but to avoid some flub that will get us in dutch." [Robert Capon, _Between Noon and Three_, p. 148]

Dave Benke

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #41 on: March 29, 2021, 08:41:17 AM »
I think the problem of it intentionally ending there is that “gar.” I think there had to be another leaf that we’ve lost and that was supplied (probably from Peter’s preaching) with the other accounts summarized in the rest of the chapter. I think the Messianic secret is a thing of the past after the Triumphal Entry. Jesus openly proclaimed it was HIS City and He was its King. “Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord.” Mk 12:10 Or more explicitly in Lk 19:38 “Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord.” Significantly, though, he didn’t lead the crowds to storm the Praetorium but up to the Temple. He’s a King of a different kind, of course.


Jesus did not proclaim himself king. The crowds did. (The reference is Mark 11:10.) Crowds were often wrong about their understanding of Jesus. Could it have been the same crowd who later yelled, "Crucify him"?


I don't think that the "secret" of Jesus' identity is revealed until the centurion sees him die. That is what properly revealed him as the Son of God. That's what the disciples and the crowds couldn't get right before.

Speaking of the crowds, this is a fine message presented by the brother (I believe) of the former Supreme Court Justice Scalia:  https://www.thecatholicthing.org/2021/03/28/barabbas-a-holy-week-examen/?utm_source=The+Catholic+Thing+Daily&utm_campaign=6b70e42101-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2018_12_07_01_02_COPY_43&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_769a14e16a-6b70e42101-244195713.

Dave Benke

peter_speckhard

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #42 on: March 29, 2021, 09:01:10 AM »
I think the problem of it intentionally ending there is that “gar.” I think there had to be another leaf that we’ve lost and that was supplied (probably from Peter’s preaching) with the other accounts summarized in the rest of the chapter. I think the Messianic secret is a thing of the past after the Triumphal Entry. Jesus openly proclaimed it was HIS City and He was its King. “Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord.” Mk 12:10 Or more explicitly in Lk 19:38 “Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord.” Significantly, though, he didn’t lead the crowds to storm the Praetorium but up to the Temple. He’s a King of a different kind, of course.



Jesus did not proclaim himself king. The crowds did. (The reference is Mark 11:10.) Crowds were often wrong about their understanding of Jesus. Could it have been the same crowd who later yelled, "Crucify him"?


I don't think that the "secret" of Jesus' identity is revealed until the centurion sees him die. That is what properly revealed him as the Son of God. That's what the disciples and the crowds couldn't get right before.

Speaking of the crowds, this is a fine message presented by the brother (I believe) of the former Supreme Court Justice Scalia:  https://www.thecatholicthing.org/2021/03/28/barabbas-a-holy-week-examen/?utm_source=The+Catholic+Thing+Daily&utm_campaign=6b70e42101-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2018_12_07_01_02_COPY_43&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_769a14e16a-6b70e42101-244195713.

Dave Benke
Very nice. Not sure how I never made the connection on the meaning of the name. But it fits perfectly. In school chapel we always have the whole congregation shout out "Crucify him!" when we do the Passion reading with 8th graders speaking the various parts. "No, not him. Release to us Barabbas!" Much to repent of.

John_Hannah

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #43 on: March 29, 2021, 09:13:52 AM »

Speaking of the crowds, this is a fine message presented by the brother (I believe) of the former Supreme Court Justice Scalia:  https://www.thecatholicthing.org/2021/03/28/barabbas-a-holy-week-examen/?utm_source=The+Catholic+Thing+Daily&utm_campaign=6b70e42101-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2018_12_07_01_02_COPY_43&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_769a14e16a-6b70e42101-244195713.

Dave Benke

An excellent homily. Fr. Paul Scalia is the son of Justice Scalia. He preached at his father's funeral, also an excellent homily. One memorable anecdote. One evening he came to his father and mother's home for dinner. His father related how he had gone to confession earlier and found himself in line at his son's booth. He immediately exited. He told his son something like, "I'll be d***d if I will confess to you."   ;D

Peace, JOHN
Pr. JOHN HANNAH, STS

Steven W Bohler

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Re: Easter and the End of Mark's Gospel
« Reply #44 on: March 29, 2021, 10:50:28 AM »

Speaking of the crowds, this is a fine message presented by the brother (I believe) of the former Supreme Court Justice Scalia:  https://www.thecatholicthing.org/2021/03/28/barabbas-a-holy-week-examen/?utm_source=The+Catholic+Thing+Daily&utm_campaign=6b70e42101-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2018_12_07_01_02_COPY_43&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_769a14e16a-6b70e42101-244195713.

Dave Benke

An excellent homily. Fr. Paul Scalia is the son of Justice Scalia. He preached at his father's funeral, also an excellent homily. One memorable anecdote. One evening he came to his father and mother's home for dinner. His father related how he had gone to confession earlier and found himself in line at his son's booth. He immediately exited. He told his son something like, "I'll be d***d if I will confess to you."   ;D

Peace, JOHN

"My son, the Father"  Cliff Clavin and Cheers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1dRgYgZ5U0