Author Topic: LCMS Inc 2020 Report  (Read 41180 times)

PrTim15

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #420 on: February 05, 2021, 06:57:59 PM »
There is, apparently, nothing more important to the future of the LCMS than when the Convention is held and whether it shall be held even if or when masks are no longer mandated or recommended.
Nothing.

Every church, school, ECE Center in the LCMS has to pivot and figure it out. We are all tele evangelists at this point...let’s boil down the this district and synod convention and get after it. What are the most important pieces?

Steven W Bohler

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #421 on: February 05, 2021, 07:51:34 PM »
There is, apparently, nothing more important to the future of the LCMS than when the Convention is held and whether it shall be held even if or when masks are no longer mandated or recommended.
Nothing.

Every church, school, ECE Center in the LCMS has to pivot and figure it out. We are all tele evangelists at this point...let’s boil down the this district and synod convention and get after it. What are the most important pieces?

"We are all tele evangelists at this point"?  Well, some of us -- I am guessing a LOT of us -- are having regular weekly in-person worship.  Maybe I owe Dr. Benke and the New Yorkers an apology; it seems that folks in CA are just as guilty of seeing themselves as the center of the universe.

PrTim15

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #422 on: February 05, 2021, 08:06:40 PM »
How funny, pot, kettle...kettle pot...for your humble consideration, we have outdoors worship, with Holy Communion and had 16 baptisms about about 35 adult confirmations last weekend. God is good.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2021, 08:13:58 PM by PrTim15 »

Dave Benke

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #423 on: February 05, 2021, 09:29:48 PM »
How funny, pot, kettle...kettle pot...for your humble consideration, we have outdoors worship, with Holy Communion and had 16 baptisms about about 35 adult confirmations last weekend. God is good.

Tim, I was talking to a media savvy guy last week and he indicated that the way the paradigm is shifting, whatever you had that was set up for in person with a side dish of virtual/online/live-stream is turning inside out quickly.  This is across various enterprises.  So I'm trying to figure out how to make the online/virtual far more a main objective of ministry, with the in-person not a side dish but an accompanying vision for the fully Sacramental aspects of being a congregation.  Not an easy journey.  At all.  But from the way I'm contacting people these days from really all over the planet, I think it has a large measure of truthiness in it. 

Dave Benke

FrPeters

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #424 on: February 05, 2021, 09:32:43 PM »
Just so you know, there are other important things.  We have followed every mandate from our government, have masks available and encourage them for all people, have roped off every other pew, practice social distancing, and have had only 2-3 actual cases traced to a contact at the church since March of 2020.  At the same time we did not ever stop holding services, every Sunday Divine Service.  We have had 9 baptisms, 7 youth confirmations, received 30+ new members (most via adult confirmation) and have adjusted our regular activities to fit the recommended parameters.  We have online services (but not live).  We have regular email updates to every member, snail mail for those who prefer, have proceeded with all meetings with zoom option for those who prefer, have our preschool going full force with accommodations to the recommended and required rules, have had funerals, etc... which is our most important concern.  It can be done.  We have done it.  I am sure we are not alone and I am sure that nearly all our congregations and pastors are focused on this first and foremost.  That said, I still think it is unnecessary to delay and that district conventions can be held and be safe for all to attend.  You are free to disagree with my opinion but you are not free to characterize what we do is unsafe or irresponsible.
Fr Larry Peters
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FrPeters

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #425 on: February 05, 2021, 09:35:44 PM »
Quote
the paradigm is shifting, whatever you had that was set up for in person with a side dish of virtual/online/live-stream is turning inside out quickly.  This is across various enterprises.  So I'm trying to figure out how to make the online/virtual far more a main objective of ministry, with the in-person not a side dish but an accompanying vision for the fully Sacramental aspects of being a congregation.  Not an easy journey.

What does that mean?  How can a sacramental and liturgical church make online/virtual the main objective?
Fr Larry Peters
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Dave Benke

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #426 on: February 05, 2021, 09:55:37 PM »
Quote
the paradigm is shifting, whatever you had that was set up for in person with a side dish of virtual/online/live-stream is turning inside out quickly.  This is across various enterprises.  So I'm trying to figure out how to make the online/virtual far more a main objective of ministry, with the in-person not a side dish but an accompanying vision for the fully Sacramental aspects of being a congregation.  Not an easy journey.

What does that mean?  How can a sacramental and liturgical church make online/virtual the main objective?

Well, first of all I didn't say that.  I said "more of a main objective," not THE main objective.  But that's not a felicitous phrase. 

So let's make it "a far more focused objective." 

In our case, as we have morphed from 100 people in person to 600 people online from all over the place, I have had to re-think the ministry of the Word.  We're not re-thinking the ministry of the Sacrament - that's in-person.  And that is where the altar, font and pulpit are located.  But at least here, that has been minimally accessible for a long time.  We refrained from the Eucharist for four months at the front end.  And many folks have not/cannot return yet who are in the NYC area.  Plus hundreds who aren't. 

Failure to acknowledge this shift, or to power through without thought and effort, would be failure to use the noggin.  So I and a few of us have some strategies set to go for when we can re-emerge that will not only bring back the power of in-person, but strengthen it in new ways.  One of them will be the continued use of the media resources.  Another will be far more openness to Christian counsel in settings other than the church building.  Another will be re-development of the communion of saints relationally. 

Dave Benke

PrTim15

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #427 on: February 05, 2021, 10:29:49 PM »
100% with you Dave...virtual church is certainly going to be an option for us for a long time. The equipment and ability to do the services online well is relatively accessible for those who are open to it. Our older members appreciate it a ton as they had been frightened by the government more than others. I’m with you on sacramental presence, says a lot about how we reopen our campus when we make the giant jump from purple to red:)

A great book I read at the onset of this is titled “Analog Church”. HIs thesis, to a degree is, “digital church informs and analog church transforms.” Obviously we were never meant to primarily follow Jesus outside of community. Digital church sure opens doors that maybe would never be knocked on. 

Jeremy_Loesch

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #428 on: February 06, 2021, 07:47:05 AM »
That's a neat phrase about digital church and analog church. I'd like to think our congregation has been hitting the mark with a lot of things. We started streaming our services in 2017, so the move to virtual was pretty seamless. We've enacted practices for in-person worship that adhere to local (KC metro) guidelines. Attendance isn't bad, classes and meetings have dual options thanks to Zoom. Twice a month we have individual communion opportunities for people who are not comfortable yet with being in large settings. Our preschool continues to operate albeit in different ways.

It's been an adjustment, not always easy. But we are trying to inform and transform.

Jeremy

Steven W Bohler

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #429 on: February 06, 2021, 09:18:55 AM »
How funny, pot, kettle...kettle pot...for your humble consideration, we have outdoors worship, with Holy Communion and had 16 baptisms about about 35 adult confirmations last weekend. God is good.

That's lovely.  My point was that, by your phrase "we are all tele evangelists at this point", you seem to think that everyone is doing "tele evangelism" because you are (much like Dr. Benke and the New Yorkers seem tho think that because THEY cannot have in-person services, no one can).  And that is just not true. 

Charles Austin

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #430 on: February 06, 2021, 09:37:53 AM »
The real point, Pastor Bohler, is not that some churches “can“ have in person services, but that those churches who are doing televised services of various sorts are learning a new way to reach out, and include more people in the life of the congregation.
Even after a pandemic does not make having televised services in some places necessary, learning how to do those services gives those congregations another tool for evangelism and participation in the life of the congregation.
The churches now having televised services may be learning skills that someday you, Pastor Bohler, might want to have. Or maybe not.
Retired ELCA Pastor. Iowa native. Now in Minneapolis. One must always ponder both the value and the dangers of poking the bear. Aroused and stimulated, the bear usually shows its true self. Or it might leap to an extreme version of itself. You never know with bears.

peter_speckhard

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #431 on: February 06, 2021, 09:49:17 AM »
Many LCMS churches in Indiana have made a few common sense adjustment to the sanctuary for the sake of distancing and then just gone ahead with church like normal this whole time. Some wear masks, some don't, but they don't have to sit near one another. I know of several that offer common cup communion and have been all along. They offer worship to those who can gather and they visit those who can't. I doubt they'll see postponing conventions as a priority.

 

PrTim15

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #432 on: February 06, 2021, 10:03:53 AM »
How funny, pot, kettle...kettle pot...for your humble consideration, we have outdoors worship, with Holy Communion and had 16 baptisms about about 35 adult confirmations last weekend. God is good.

That's lovely.  My point was that, by your phrase "we are all tele evangelists at this point", you seem to think that everyone is doing "tele evangelism" because you are (much like Dr. Benke and the New Yorkers seem tho think that because THEY cannot have in-person services, no one can).  And that is just not true.

Got it and sarcasm noted...

Randy Bosch

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #433 on: February 06, 2021, 11:18:05 AM »
Remember that it is rather difficult, and almost always painful, to caress the ones you love with a keyboard or a computer screen.

Terry W Culler

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Re: LCMS Inc 2020 Report
« Reply #434 on: February 06, 2021, 11:29:34 AM »
I can't help but think that televised services contributes to the "church as entertainment" model until recently dominated by the mega-church, mini-gospel model.  In addition to be contrary to Scripture (remember not ceasing to meet together) it also reduces the work of the cure of souls to the lowest level possible without closing altogether.  Reading John Owen I came across an idea that struck me as being utterly contrary to what we seem to think important in these days.  Since all bishops/pastors will one day stand before the judgment seat of Christ to answer for our cure of souls, we should be careful about wanting to expand our cure beyond that which we can rightly do.
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