Author Topic: Now that the 2020 Election is over....  (Read 55919 times)

James S. Rustad

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #510 on: November 14, 2020, 05:32:28 PM »
Those who keep crying “fraud” are going to have to explain why they don’t trust the entire law enforcement system of our country.

As will those trying to shut down any investigation of any allegations of fraud.

We need to prove or disprove the allegations in order to maintain confidence in our elections.

peter_speckhard

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #511 on: November 14, 2020, 05:58:09 PM »
Those who keep crying “fraud” are going to have to explain why they don’t trust the entire law enforcement system of our country.

As will those trying to shut down any investigation of any allegations of fraud.

We need to prove or disprove the allegations in order to maintain confidence in our elections.
Agreed. If someone deliberately cast fraudulent votes just to prove the system was flawed, you can bet they’d be prosecuted. But when someone shows that a dead person voted, nobody tracks down the person responsible for the fraudulent vote. Nothing undermined confidence in the system like making those who play by the rules feel like they’re being played. As the Nevada article showed, the big safeguard against fraud was supposed to be the signature match, but ballots without matching signatures are routinely being accepted.

peter_speckhard

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Charles Austin

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #513 on: November 14, 2020, 06:40:41 PM »
By the way, according to the BBC, the pro Trump rally in Washington today had people shouting “An-ti-fa! An-ti-fa!”
Wassup with that?
Retired ELCA pastor. Iowa born. Now in Minnesota. Twice-vaccinated.

Julio

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #514 on: November 14, 2020, 07:47:17 PM »
Those who keep crying “fraud” are going to have to explain why they don’t trust the entire law enforcement system of our country.

As will those trying to shut down any investigation of any allegations of fraud.

We need to prove or disprove the allegations in order to maintain confidence in our elections.
The more concerning thing Mr Runstad is attempting to understand why there is such fear of these investigations ... if everything is fair and above board, those calling for investigations will simply be proven wrong  ... if those calling for investigations are correct, well honest law abiding voters have been disenfranchised.  

Sounds like something important enough to look into ... but then those who fear investigations are the same people who fear photo id at the polling place.

peter_speckhard

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #515 on: November 14, 2020, 07:57:47 PM »
By the way, according to the BBC, the pro Trump rally in Washington today had people shouting “An-ti-fa! An-ti-fa!”
Wassup with that?
BBC, not NBC. Just noting that because someone seems all bent out of shape by this post without having read it.

Julio

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #516 on: November 14, 2020, 08:18:42 PM »
Joe Biden is the President-Elect of the United States.  Refusal of deniers to acknowledge this is dissemination of toxicity  in our democracy.  Deniers are breaking faith with American history, ideals, and ideas.   It is un-American and disloyal.

How come faith with American history, ideals, and being "un-American and disloyal," only applies to Democratic presumptive winners?

You and Pastor Austin have spent the past several months just trashing the President of the United States every chance you get.  Please spare me the call to civility now.  It is hollow and empty coming from either of you given your behavior here of late.

If all that is too obtuse, let me say it more plainly -- I don't care at all what either of you have to say about criticizing Joe Biden or anyone else, about the integrity of elections, about respect for the office.  I will behave as I always have with regard to those things, which is to say, better than either of you.
Mr Teigen:  please demonstrate from your body of posts that you have acted in a civil and God pleasing manner in respect to President Trump .. remember your previous actions speak far louder than your feigned call for loyalty today.

By the way, there is no Biblical mandate addressing honor and respect due the fictitious non existing office of president elect. Please show the Biblically mandated respect for the current POTUS.  Thank you

RogerMartim

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #517 on: November 14, 2020, 08:24:10 PM »
I think it is so funny that some of you on this board insist that President-Elect Biden is a presumptive President-Elect only. Five seconds after Trump stepped over the magical 270 line in 2016 he was President-Elect and no one brought up this, "Oh, but he isn't until..."

Didn't the Department of Homeland Security state the other day that 2020 Election was the most secure and safe one ever? Yet, again some of you insist that there had to have been fraud, rampant or otherwise. Thousands marched today in DC insisting that the election was stolen. The Department of Homeland Security is under Trump's purview. How many attorneys have now walked away from being connected to this paranoia because there was no basis?

Julio

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #518 on: November 14, 2020, 08:32:45 PM »
I think it is so funny that some of you on this board insist that President-Elect Biden is a presumptive President-Elect only. Five seconds after Trump stepped over the magical 270 line in 2016 he was President-Elect and no one brought up this, "Oh, but he isn't until..."

Didn't the Department of Homeland Security state the other day that 2020 Election was the most secure and safe one ever? Yet, again some of you insist that there had to have been fraud, rampant or otherwise. Thousands marched today in DC insisting that the election was stolen. The Department of Homeland Security is under Trump's purview. How many attorneys have now walked away from being connected to this paranoia because there was no basis?
Mr Martin ... today there is far less respect for the press than anytime in the country’s history.  The press including Fox cuts away from Presidential statements because they have anointed themselves as ‘fact checkers’.  The media’s job is to report the news... not be the news. Facts can be checked after the speech is over ... they don’t have to interrupt it!

The press is not the final arbiter of the election ... unless you have a different copy of the constitution than the rest of us.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2020, 08:34:42 PM by Julio »

Brian Stoffregen

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #519 on: November 14, 2020, 08:39:25 PM »
https://www.reviewjournal.com/opinion/opinion-columns/victor-joecks/victor-joecks-clark-county-election-officials-accepted-my-signature-on-8-ballot-envelopes-2182390/

Do people believe this story in the media? Mail-in voting is not secure. The "Covid excuse" forced many states to go firmly toward more mail-in voting, and, as was widely predicted, rampant fraud has resulted.


However, a day earlier, the same paper reported that voter fraud allegations were unproven.
https://www.reviewjournal.com/investigations/voter-fraud-unproven-in-nevada-despite-multiple-trump-campaign-claims-2181421/
All allegations are unproven. Once proven, they become facts. Do you believe that thousands of dead people voted in this election?


No. Even if they did, 1000 less votes wouldn't make a difference.
So if someone gave you a list of thousand people whose votes were recorded in this election but who had died long before early voting began, what would you think?


First of all, I would think the person made up the list.
Secondly, if it was shown that 1000 dead people had voted, I would see if they had been flagged in any way.
Third, if their votes were counted, I would explore what went wrong in the system to allow them to go through.
Finally, I would explore who committed the crime and seek to have them prosecuted.
"The church … had made us like ill-taught piano students; we play our songs, but we never really hear them, because our main concern is not to make music, but but to avoid some flub that will get us in dutch." [Robert Capon, _Between Noon and Three_, p. 148]

Brian Stoffregen

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #520 on: November 14, 2020, 08:54:20 PM »
I think it is so funny that some of you on this board insist that President-Elect Biden is a presumptive President-Elect only. Five seconds after Trump stepped over the magical 270 line in 2016 he was President-Elect and no one brought up this, "Oh, but he isn't until..."

Didn't the Department of Homeland Security state the other day that 2020 Election was the most secure and safe one ever? Yet, again some of you insist that there had to have been fraud, rampant or otherwise. Thousands marched today in DC insisting that the election was stolen. The Department of Homeland Security is under Trump's purview. How many attorneys have now walked away from being connected to this paranoia because there was no basis?
Mr Martin ... today there is far less respect for the press than anytime in the country’s history.  The press including Fox cuts away from Presidential statements because they have anointed themselves as ‘fact checkers’.  The media’s job is to report the news... not be the news. Facts can be checked after the speech is over ... they don’t have to interrupt it!


The press are not in the business of reporting lies as truth. A lie is not news. It's one person's mistaken opinion, or a purposeful attempt to deceive. διάβολος (diabolos) which is often translated "devil," literally means, "the slanderer." John 8:44 has Jesus saying: Your father is the devil [diabolos]. You are his children, and you want to do what your father wants. He was a murderer from the beginning. He has never stood for the truth, because there’s no truth in him. Whenever that liar speaks, he speaks according to his own nature, because he’s a liar and the father of liars.

If any news organization is not going to be the tool of the devil, it must seek to show the truth and avoid lies.
"The church … had made us like ill-taught piano students; we play our songs, but we never really hear them, because our main concern is not to make music, but but to avoid some flub that will get us in dutch." [Robert Capon, _Between Noon and Three_, p. 148]

David Garner

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #521 on: November 14, 2020, 09:43:09 PM »
I think it is so funny that some of you on this board insist that President-Elect Biden is a presumptive President-Elect only. Five seconds after Trump stepped over the magical 270 line in 2016 he was President-Elect and no one brought up this, "Oh, but he isn't until..."

Your memory fails you. I remember Jill Stein’s recount. I remember the pleas for faithless electors.

I remember the last 4 years for that matter. Russia collusion, impeachment, the Kavanaugh hearings.

I accept that Joe Biden has won. I don’t accept fake calls for civility from the uncivil.
Orthodox Reader and former Lutheran (LCMS and WELS).

David Garner

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #522 on: November 14, 2020, 09:45:36 PM »
I think it is so funny that some of you on this board insist that President-Elect Biden is a presumptive President-Elect only. Five seconds after Trump stepped over the magical 270 line in 2016 he was President-Elect and no one brought up this, "Oh, but he isn't until..."

Didn't the Department of Homeland Security state the other day that 2020 Election was the most secure and safe one ever? Yet, again some of you insist that there had to have been fraud, rampant or otherwise. Thousands marched today in DC insisting that the election was stolen. The Department of Homeland Security is under Trump's purview. How many attorneys have now walked away from being connected to this paranoia because there was no basis?
Mr Martin ... today there is far less respect for the press than anytime in the country’s history.  The press including Fox cuts away from Presidential statements because they have anointed themselves as ‘fact checkers’.  The media’s job is to report the news... not be the news. Facts can be checked after the speech is over ... they don’t have to interrupt it!


The press are not in the business of reporting lies as truth. A lie is not news. It's one person's mistaken opinion, or a purposeful attempt to deceive. διάβολος (diabolos) which is often translated "devil," literally means, "the slanderer." John 8:44 has Jesus saying: Your father is the devil [diabolos]. You are his children, and you want to do what your father wants. He was a murderer from the beginning. He has never stood for the truth, because there’s no truth in him. Whenever that liar speaks, he speaks according to his own nature, because he’s a liar and the father of liars.

If any news organization is not going to be the tool of the devil, it must seek to show the truth and avoid lies.

This is why half the country doesn’t trust the press. Precisely because they lie, and are therefore in your own words tools of the devil.
Orthodox Reader and former Lutheran (LCMS and WELS).

Richard Johnson

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #523 on: November 14, 2020, 09:46:35 PM »
Thousands marched today in DC insisting that the election was stolen.

Thousands? Thousands? What happened to "Million MAGA March"?
The Rev. Richard O. Johnson, STS

Charles Austin

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Re: Now that the 2020 Election is over....
« Reply #524 on: November 14, 2020, 09:58:22 PM »
I don’t know your profession, Mr. Garner, but supposing I said of it “this is why half the country doesn’t trust [your profession]. Precisely because they [do the opposite of what your profession is supposed to do] and therefore are tools of the devil.”
Sounds stupid, right? Doesn’t help dialog or understanding, right?
Working in the secular media, I often had to knock down people’s warped views of faith, Christianity and the Church.
I really tire of you who declare all reporters liars.
Retired ELCA pastor. Iowa born. Now in Minnesota. Twice-vaccinated.