Author Topic: Mockingbird on Confederacy  (Read 18115 times)

Brian Stoffregen

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #180 on: July 14, 2020, 06:29:16 PM »
Indeed. Jesus' love extends to all. He died for the sins of all mankind.

And he died esp. for you, his neighbor!


It is the height of selfishness to look at Jesus' death as bringing salvation to me. How much more loving is it to emphasize Jesus' death for my neighbor - and let that belief control my actions towards others? In fact, it may be that the salvation that comes to me is precisely this new way of looking at and relating to others; rather than the self-centeredness that's the heart of our original sin.

Perhaps you donít read that Jesus died for your sins as well.  Iím sorry for that.  Missing out on his love for you!


Of course I read that. Faith takes what Jesus did for all and accepts it for one's self. I'm stating that this belief about Jesus' giving up his life for others means that the way we look at treat others has to change. Love for neighbors, orphans, widows, immigrants, and enemies comes before love of self. Priorities change.
"The church Ö had made us like ill-taught piano students; we play our songs, but we never really hear them, because our main concern is not to make music, but but to avoid some flub that will get us in dutch." [Robert Capon, _Between Noon and Three_, p. 148]

readselerttoo

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #181 on: July 14, 2020, 06:40:52 PM »
Indeed. Jesus' love extends to all. He died for the sins of all mankind.

And he died esp. for you, his neighbor!


It is the height of selfishness to look at Jesus' death as bringing salvation to me. How much more loving is it to emphasize Jesus' death for my neighbor - and let that belief control my actions towards others? In fact, it may be that the salvation that comes to me is precisely this new way of looking at and relating to others; rather than the self-centeredness that's the heart of our original sin.

Perhaps you donít read that Jesus died for your sins as well.  Iím sorry for that.  Missing out on his love for you!


Of course I read that. Faith takes what Jesus did for all and accepts it for one's self. I'm stating that this belief about Jesus' giving up his life for others means that the way we look at treat others has to change. Love for neighbors, orphans, widows, immigrants, and enemies comes before love of self. Priorities change.

Of course it has to change or else there wouldnít be witnessing to others about Jesusí love for them.  Ultimately the preacherís role it to make sure that Godís love for others is conveyed to the point that each hearer receives the Christian forgiveness of sins personally...that it is for you and not just some general Joe-schmoe. 
« Last Edit: July 14, 2020, 06:44:13 PM by readselerttoo »

readselerttoo

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #182 on: July 14, 2020, 06:48:45 PM »
The Christian ďlove one anotherĒ is fundamentally unselfish.  Itís about Jesusí love first and not mine.  In fact one of the joys of Christian fellowship is that the other comes first in the partnership with Christ and the other at the same time!  In fact loss of self for Jesusí love is what Galatians 2:19-21 is about. 

Brian Stoffregen

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #183 on: July 14, 2020, 07:38:47 PM »
Indeed. Jesus' love extends to all. He died for the sins of all mankind.

And he died esp. for you, his neighbor!


It is the height of selfishness to look at Jesus' death as bringing salvation to me. How much more loving is it to emphasize Jesus' death for my neighbor - and let that belief control my actions towards others? In fact, it may be that the salvation that comes to me is precisely this new way of looking at and relating to others; rather than the self-centeredness that's the heart of our original sin.

Perhaps you donít read that Jesus died for your sins as well.  Iím sorry for that.  Missing out on his love for you!


Of course I read that. Faith takes what Jesus did for all and accepts it for one's self. I'm stating that this belief about Jesus' giving up his life for others means that the way we look at treat others has to change. Love for neighbors, orphans, widows, immigrants, and enemies comes before love of self. Priorities change.

Of course it has to change or else there wouldnít be witnessing to others about Jesusí love for them.  Ultimately the preacherís role it to make sure that Godís love for others is conveyed to the point that each hearer receives the Christian forgiveness of sins personally...that it is for you and not just some general Joe-schmoe.


A purpose of communion is that each individual receives that grace "for me" as one eats and drinks. However, my feeling is that Lutherans have gone overboard with the individualizing of the sacrament. Paul's argument and also in the Didache is that it unifies us into one body like wheat from different fields being gathered into one loaf (and we could add, as grapes from different vines become the wine in one cup). The grace given in bread and wine is not just "for me," but we also need to think that it's "for us." It creates communion between God and me; but also creates communion between me and the other communicants.


(Actually, I think that the LCMS does a better job on the corporate aspect of communion than ELCA, but I think they have it backwards. Communion creates the unity, rather than it being a sign that we are unified.)
"The church Ö had made us like ill-taught piano students; we play our songs, but we never really hear them, because our main concern is not to make music, but but to avoid some flub that will get us in dutch." [Robert Capon, _Between Noon and Three_, p. 148]

Dave Benke

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #184 on: July 17, 2020, 12:18:44 PM »
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/07/17/defense-secretary-mark-esper-bans-confederate-flags-military-bases/5458809002/

No more confederate flags on military bases under the topic of appropriate symbols.

Dave Benke

DeHall1

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #185 on: July 17, 2020, 12:27:29 PM »
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/07/17/defense-secretary-mark-esper-bans-confederate-flags-military-bases/5458809002/

No more confederate flags on military bases under the topic of appropriate symbols.

Dave Benke
I served in the US Army for 12 years (1989 - 2001).  I can honestly say I've never seen a Confederate flag displayed on any of the military bases I've been posted on or visited.

John_Hannah

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #186 on: July 17, 2020, 12:37:30 PM »
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/07/17/defense-secretary-mark-esper-bans-confederate-flags-military-bases/5458809002/

No more confederate flags on military bases under the topic of appropriate symbols.

Dave Benke
I served in the US Army for 12 years (1989 - 2001).  I can honestly say I've never seen a Confederate flag displayed on any of the military bases I've been posted on or visited.

I served for 30 years and never saw any displayed, except occasionally on a soldier's vehicle like many other sorts of stickers with slogans.

Peace, JOHN
Pr. JOHN HANNAH, STS

Dave Benke

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #187 on: July 17, 2020, 12:52:57 PM »
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/07/17/defense-secretary-mark-esper-bans-confederate-flags-military-bases/5458809002/

No more confederate flags on military bases under the topic of appropriate symbols.

Dave Benke
I served in the US Army for 12 years (1989 - 2001).  I can honestly say I've never seen a Confederate flag displayed on any of the military bases I've been posted on or visited.

I guess then it's a decision on display of symbols that's purely symbolic.

Dave Benke

Dan Fienen

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #188 on: July 18, 2020, 08:20:29 AM »
I'm no fan of the Confederate battle flag and applaud its removal from the Mississippi state flag and from official state and national buildings and installations. But what people choose to display in their own space should be their own concern. If freedom of speech allows people to publicly burn the U.S. flag as a form of protest, it should also allow people to display the Stars and Bars in their own place if they wish.
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John_Hannah

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #189 on: July 18, 2020, 08:47:47 AM »
I'm no fan of the Confederate battle flag and applaud its removal from the Mississippi state flag and from official state and national buildings and installations. But what people choose to display in their own space should be their own concern. If freedom of speech allows people to publicly burn the U.S. flag as a form of protest, it should also allow people to display the Stars and Bars in their own place if they wish.

They may, of course. But a United States military installation is not their own place.

Peace, JOHN
Pr. JOHN HANNAH, STS

Dan Fienen

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #190 on: July 18, 2020, 09:13:05 AM »
Agreed. What I'm not clear on is the rules that apply to how someone's personal living space on a military base is regulated.
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John_Hannah

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #191 on: July 18, 2020, 09:44:35 AM »
Agreed. What I'm not clear on is the rules that apply to how someone's personal living space on a military base is regulated.

I'm not a JAG officer (military attorney). Probably, what's inside would not be touched. Probably, it could not be displayed outside on the lawn.

Peace, JOHN
Pr. JOHN HANNAH, STS

Matt Hummel

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Re: Mockingbird on Confederacy
« Reply #192 on: July 18, 2020, 12:15:53 PM »
Agreed. What I'm not clear on is the rules that apply to how someone's personal living space on a military base is regulated.

I'm not a JAG officer (military attorney). Probably, what's inside would not be touched. Probably, it could not be displayed outside on the lawn.

Peace, JOHN

John- I think a line I have heard from Senior NCOs and Officers that actually made it into one movie holds, ďWe are here to defend democracy, not practice it.Ē But it would be interesting to see what the UCMJ says on the matter.
Matt Hummel


ďThe chief purpose of life, for any of us, is to increase according to our capacity our knowledge of God by all means we have, and to be moved by it to praise and thanks.Ē

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