Author Topic: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?  (Read 6773 times)

James J Eivan

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #15 on: June 05, 2020, 01:29:55 AM »
James writes (my emphasis added);
Presenting David Brooks as a real conservative is totally laughable ... Rev Austin's own words show his is fully aware of Mr Brooks liberal tendencies ... he describes Me Brooks as 'smart, reasonable, and historically aware, and can discuss some things

I comment:
Hey! If you say those words Describe “liberal tendencies” and can’t be used to describe a conservative, I guess I shouldn’t try to argue with you.
Point being that Rev Austin never attempted (and quite purposefully) to use conservative when speaking of Mr Brooks.  Knowing that Rev Austin chooses his words carefully ... the words he chose not to use said volumes more that what he did use.

Charles Austin

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #16 on: June 05, 2020, 03:40:34 AM »
Peter writes:
Brooks hates that Trump is such a bull in a china shop, but the whole point of Trump was to smash the china.

I comment:
Was the china supposed to be the Constitution, democracy, our role in the world, the rule of law and the rights of protestors?
Retired ELCA pastor. Iowa born. Back home from Sioux City after three days and a pleasant reunion of the East High School class of - can you believe it! - 1959.

RandyBosch

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #17 on: June 05, 2020, 09:20:53 AM »
Peter writes:
Brooks hates that Trump is such a bull in a china shop, but the whole point of Trump was to smash the china.

I comment:
Was the china supposed to be the Constitution, democracy, our role in the world, the rule of law and the rights of protestors?

With the exception of the kerfuffle that occurred when the federal police ineptly cleared a path for the president to visit a recently fire-damaged church (where the message board out front says "All are Welcome") and some inappropriate blustering, Trump isn't the one who smashed the rest of your china set -- it was local police, mayors and governors in a bunch of cities taking direction from their local elected leadership and appointed commissioners - and in some cases from their own systemic racism.

There was more than a little bit of china-smashing by rioters.  The extent of destruction on many major shopping streets was almost as extensive as a Kristelnacht re-enactment, God forbid.  Perhaps the victims of the smashed windows, looted stores and beatings/shootings of their owners were part of one presidential candidate's recently uttered "10 to 15 percent of Americans are not very good people"?

James J Eivan

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #18 on: June 05, 2020, 09:44:14 AM »
Peter writes:
Brooks hates that Trump is such a bull in a china shop, but the whole point of Trump was to smash the china.

I comment:
Was the china supposed to be the Constitution, democracy, our role in the world, the rule of law and the rights of protestors?
When are you going to pause your incessant screed and open your eyes to all the damage and bodily injury inflicted 'protesters'?  If black lives really matter to you, where is your righteous indignation and condemnation of the senseless murder of the retired policeman in St Louis.  Hopefully I'm able to locate the video I saw showing violence committed against property and the senseless bodily injury you refuse to condemn.

Apparently being tolerant includes turning a blind eye at violence and bodily injury such as this ... your refusal to a knowledge these tragic events is hypocritical!

Charles Austin

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #19 on: June 05, 2020, 11:37:48 AM »
Randy Bosch writes:
With the exception of the kerfuffle that occurred when the federal police ineptly cleared a path for the president to visit a recently fire-damaged church (where the message board out front says "All are Welcome") and some inappropriate blustering, Trump isn't the one who smashed the rest of your china set -- it was local police, mayors and governors in a bunch of cities taking direction from their local elected leadership and appointed commissioners - and in some cases from their own systemic racism.
I comment:
It should have been clear that I was referring to much more "china-breaking" than has gone on in the past two weeks.

Randy Bosch writes:'
There was more than a little bit of china-smashing by rioters.  The extent of destruction on many major shopping streets was almost as extensive as a Kristelnacht re-enactment, God forbid.
I comment:
I shall have to make one of those "with all due respect" comments. I lived 40 years among Jews and in a place where they came to constitute about 40 percent of the citizenry. So, with all due respect, you have obviously not, or you would know that making any, yes, any comparison with things that happened during the Nazi era is offensive and highly insensitive. Your "almost as extensive as a Kristallnacht (and yes, again, spelling counts) re-enactment" might be excused because you don't know any better. But now you do.
That inept comparison fails on many levels. On those terrible days in 1938, the damage was focused on one segment of the population, perpetrated by agencies under the direction of the government, and part of a much larger, institutional campaign against Jews.
Personally, I consider this president a grave threat to our democracy and capable of trashing our constitution and wanting to bring the power of our military down on those who oppose him. But he is not Hitler. The German had an obscenely warped view of nationalism and German "purity." Our president has only a desire to stoke his ego, appear to be a "tough guy," flatten those who oppose him no matter what religion or party they inhabit, and get re-elected.
Note to all: I do not find it useful to answer the various "questions" posed by James. Sensible people here will understand that I oppose all violence against persons and riotous damage of property. The fact that I don't mention incidents dear to his heart means nothing; and I have no intent of trying to show how every incident of violence in every setting is not equal.
Retired ELCA pastor. Iowa born. Back home from Sioux City after three days and a pleasant reunion of the East High School class of - can you believe it! - 1959.

James J Eivan

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #20 on: June 05, 2020, 12:23:42 PM »
Note to all: I do not find it useful to answer the various "questions" posed by James. Sensible people here will understand that I oppose all violence against persons and riotous damage of property. The fact that I don't mention incidents dear to his heart means nothing; and I have no intent of trying to show how every incident of violence in every setting is not equal.
Rev Austin feigns ‘I oppose all violence ...’ yet rather than clearly condemn ongoing violence, his screeds against the police and other law enforcement personnel whose body and life are threaten routinely by those he seems so eager to defend.


Massive amounts of funds are being contributed for restitution of those whose property has unjustly been damaged or destroyed .. the bias press praising the actions without and condemnation of those who viciously and unnecessarily caused the damage and distraction.


Rev Austin, where your heart is ... your words will follow!😶

Michael Slusser

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #21 on: June 05, 2020, 12:36:45 PM »
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10101056006052992&id=79101091
I don't know Candace Owens, nor do I know Kenneth Mack II, the author of this FB critique of some of her work--perhaps not the piece Tom Eckstein shared with us. Because the FB link may expire, I'll try to copy and paste his text, too.
Mack is a Republican and a Black Pentecostal preacher.
Quote
❗A LETTER TO CANDACE OWENS❗

Dear Candace,

The purpose of this letter is not condescending nor written for eristic intentions, but to express concerns that are noticed by the black community (including notable members within the Republican party). I am not opposed to your political ideologies; actually, we share the same viewpoints, but have chosen to express them differently. Conservative adherents are grieved about your intellectual dishonesty & self-deprecating remarks you have opined, not only regarding the case of Ahmaud Arbery, but persistent negative commentary towards African Americans. In addition, your increasing extreme beliefs concerning "true conservative ideals," has caused division in our nation in the name of patriotism.

The following statements have proceeded out of your mouth in the absence of wisdom, couth, & circumspect. For each deplorable comment; I have responded with a compassionate refutation.

“Blacks kill twice as many whites as whites kill blacks.”

Candace, criminality is pervasive throughout both black & white communities. 57% of crimes involving white victims were committed by white perpetrators, while 15% were committed by blacks. Black violent crime victims composed 63% of crimes committed by black perpetrators, while 11% were committed by whites. Intra-racial victimization is significantly higher than the percentage of interracial victimization (robbery is the only exception). The rate of white on white crime is actually four times higher than black on white crime. Pertaining to murder,73% of white crime victims were committed by whites, and 80% of black victims were targeted by other African Americans. Even violent criminal acts such as sexual assault are not led by black men. 57% are done so by white men & 27% for black men. I am alarmed, (but not surprised) the distorted statistics in which you publicly disseminate emanate from the infamous white supremacist Jared Taylor.

“Black America is silent concerning gang violence within our own communities. “Our culture is a joke.”

Endemic warfare in the form of gang violence has not in any way been ignored by the black community. Many gang prevention programs have been directed by prominent black leaders, and former gang members enhancing the family unit, providing economic opportunity, endeavoring to end cycles of poverty and crime. This erroneous statement is engendered by a personal quarantine from the black community unless paid to appear for self-promotion. There are nearly inordinate amounts of programs specifically targeted to mitigate the effects of gang violence. Do not falsely postulate that blacks do not accept accountability for intra-racial violence, while you absolve racially motivated crimes labeling blacks who decry racism as “emotional” or “ignorant”. It is a moral and theological responsibility to fervently expose racism and endemic warfare with equal vehemence.

Also, I want to encourage you to evaluate your myopic view of the term “black community.” Black families are not relegated to the hood or inner city. 39% of black families live in the suburbs, 36% live in cities, 15% in small metropolitan areas, & 10% in rural areas. Black families are just as diverse as their contributions to the USA. Our immense cultural legacy is certainly no laughing matter.

“Still wondering why black Americans lag behind other races?”

In certain aspects, African Americans certainly face challenges, specifically in public school education. However, African Americans are garnering much success. Black women are the fastest growing entrepreneurs in the United States, and abortion has declined each year since 2011. 2.5 million black men are considered upper middle class, and poverty has reduced from 41% to 18%. Black men have increased middle class status from 38% to 57%. Literally one in two black men have reached middle class or higher. Prior to Covid 19, black unemployment was the lowest in US history. The most elite athletes, entertainers, and many geniuses are black. Obviously the first minority President was not Asian, Hispanic, or Middle Eastern, but a black man by the name of Barack Obama. Regardless of his political views, to be the most powerful man in the world as a black man is MONUMENTAL and should receive bi-partisan admiration.

“Name one other race in America that protests & riots when their criminals die while committing crimes.”

Criminal history should not result in death by vigilante. It is the responsibility of the legal process to determine in a court of law who should be convicted of crime. Blacks (especially conservatives) are disappointed of your viewpoint concerning the senseless deaths of black men & women. Jordan Davis did not have a criminal history and was shot dead in his own vehicle for the volume of his music. Botham Jean had no criminal history, Atatiana Jefferson was inside of her house when a bullet rendered her lifeless, & the nine people who were murdered by Dylan Roof were worshipping. The increase of protests within the black community is not due to the endless babble of racial conspiracy theories, but the language of racial intolerance that has gone unheard.

“White nationalism & racism are not a serious threat, but the real issue is a constant media narrative for blacks to operate in fear and vote democrat during the election cycle.”

Candace, this is probably the most heinous comment you have made. Racism is not maintained by a political party. Prejudice is a posture of the heart. I certainly agree the media has created false narratives concerning race, but this does not disregard the very real presence of racism in the United States & throughout the world. Your conjecture is also hypocritical. In 2007, you were harassed, threatened, and experienced the reality of racism first hand, as the son of then Connecticut mayor Dannel Malloy perpetuated the crime. You left your high school for six weeks due to racial trauma. This resulted in a $37,500 settlement in January of 2008, aided by the legal council of the NAACP.

FBI statistics have reported hate crimes are at a 16 year high, with blacks being 47% of targeted victims (as you stated we are 13% of the population). There are currently over 1,000 hate groups in the United States with many criminal investigations/arrests in relation to law enforcement hate group associations. Racism is prevalent on domestic, societal, corporate, environmental, & political levels. The most dangerous prison gang in the USA is not the black dominated bloods or crips, but the Aryan Brotherhood who are only 1% of the prison population, but responsible for 18% of the murders in the federal prison population.

“Avid joggers do not run in khakis”

This statement is a result of the discriminatory act of physiognomy, where the internal character of a man is determined by his facial/physical appearance. I am not concerned with the clothing someone is wearing, but the evidence presented in the case. While it is true Ahmaud entered a house under construction. It is also ostensible that he did not steal anything out of the home. Even if the young man did “trespass” he should not have been pursued by two men with guns. I live in a brand new subdivision where homes are currently under construction with people viewing them in broad daylight without an appointment and they all have lived to tell about it.

Lastly, your extreme associations with other black people who believe to be authentically conservative is to abandon African ancestry is nefarious. What is even more alarming is you use the holy scriptures to do so. I have heard comments such as “I am not black. I am American.” There is a vast difference between ethnicity & nationality. Ethnicity is the internal DNA consisting of familial, & cultural phenotypes preserving genetic identity. Nationality is the external geographic landscape where an individual was born or gained citizenship status.

Candace, believe it or not, there is an awakening of conscious conservatism where black men and women will fully embrace and celebrate the Christ likeness of their beautiful black complexion, while preserving conservative political ideals. God is not colorblind, but purposefully created ethnicity and culture as a multicultural reflection of his image and likeness in the earth! God is the inception of Genesis 1:26 & the fulfillment of Revelations 7:9.

Your actions have hindered the potential “blexit” from the Democratic party to Republican affiliation due to your Eurocentric obsequious behavior. Although I am a PROUD Republican, I will not engage in self righteous behavior and gasconade as a “better black.” I will not have white conservatives endorse me publicly as a satisfactory African American because I am conservative, but privately call black liberals niggers. Truthfully, I love black Democrats as well, no matter how much political vitriol between us. It is my desire that you evaluate your motivation for politics. Political popularity, nor personal acclaim are the proper aspirations for government involvement. Government is designed to establish civility, economic prosperity, and preserve inalienable human rights with integrity.

Sincerely,

Kenneth Mack II

Peace,
Michael
« Last Edit: June 05, 2020, 12:48:09 PM by Michael Slusser »
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Charles Austin

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #23 on: June 05, 2020, 03:59:56 PM »
Yeah, That video is a brilliant example of civil dialogue. Not.
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Coach-Rev

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #24 on: June 05, 2020, 05:37:23 PM »
Yeah, That video is a brilliant example of civil dialogue. Not.

There ARE important factors mentioned here, despite the source (that is indeed a biased one).

“'When black people kill black people, they don’t come out and do this crap,' she said. 'The only time they do this crap is when a white person does it.'  Ninety-four percent of black homicide victims from 1976 to 2005 were killed by other African-Americans, the National Review reported last year.

Over the Memorial Day weekend in Chicago, 84 people were wounded by gun violence and 24 of them died, the Chicago Sun-Times reported.

Yumga attempted to point out facts like these but was met with willful ignorance and combativeness."


Way to so casually dismiss an opinion contrary to your own.  Way to meet her perspective with willful ignorance and combativeness, Charles.

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Eileen Smith

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2020, 07:18:23 PM »
Yeah, That video is a brilliant example of civil dialogue. Not.

There ARE important factors mentioned here, despite the source (that is indeed a biased one).

“'When black people kill black people, they don’t come out and do this crap,' she said. 'The only time they do this crap is when a white person does it.'  Ninety-four percent of black homicide victims from 1976 to 2005 were killed by other African-Americans, the National Review reported last year.

Over the Memorial Day weekend in Chicago, 84 people were wounded by gun violence and 24 of them died, the Chicago Sun-Times reported.

Yumga attempted to point out facts like these but was met with willful ignorance and combativeness."


Way to so casually dismiss an opinion contrary to your own.  Way to meet her perspective with willful ignorance and combativeness, Charles.

I found Candace's video one of not really comprehending what is happening in America and what has gone on for years.  There are points I'd quibble with but primarily all I can see is the hopelessness of blacks.  Spending most of my life in the Bronx and Queens I saw neighborhoods decline and I don't believe for a moment it was lack of upkeep (as some have thought to put out there) but day after day after day of living in a world of no hope.  This builds and builds until it simply overflows and we're seeing that played out.

The more important video is the one of a retired (doesn't matter - active or retired) law enforcement officer killing another human being in such a brutal way that I can't even write about it without tears.  There are no adjectives.  Reprehensible, deplorable - there are none that captures this act and the other officers who chose to watch.  AND, perhaps most importantly, not simply blacks who saw it but young blacks who see this as the way their lives will play out.  So they loot a store - what does it matter - they have no hope in our legal system.

Are there, as alleged, people protesting for reasons other than this senseless death; that is, do some have another agenda?  That may be, but it doesn't negate from the issue that a man suffered a death he should not have endured by people whom he should be able to trust.

I have been unable to discuss this death even with family and friends who may agree with me.  I may not comment again on this thread as some things are just too difficult to ponder.  But I will state this and it comes with an apology of sorts.  For almost four years I have read Pastor Austin's assessment of Trump and while I might not like Trump I didn't see him as one to be feared.  I am prepared to say that I agree with Pastor Austin.  This man is soulless.  He has little touch with reality and in the reality of the world he lives in there is absolutely no compassion or even the smallest attempt at understanding others.  His handing of COVID convinced me that he is not equipped to lead this country in a crisis and these past few days have convinced me that what I simply put down to ego is rather megalomania and that he is, indeed, dangerous.


peter_speckhard

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #26 on: June 05, 2020, 07:29:51 PM »
Does anyone yet have any evidence that race was a factor? Allowing that assumption to stand without evidence will contribute more to perpetuating hopelessness among young black men than almost anything else.

Tom Eckstein

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #27 on: June 05, 2020, 08:06:32 PM »
Does anyone yet have any evidence that race was a factor? Allowing that assumption to stand without evidence will contribute more to perpetuating hopelessness among young black men than almost anything else.

Peter, I agree with your question.  What is the evidence that this particular horrible act by a police officer was racially motivated?  When black police officers unjustly kill black or white citizens, is this racially motivated?

There is no doubt that black people have had deep struggles in America, but things have improved greatly in the past 50 years - and yet the black community, especially in inner cities, continues to have serious problems.  Is it all because of poverty?  There are plenty of people of all skin color who live in poverty and yet do not view their lives as hopeless nor do they resort to a life of crime.  There are deeper cultural problems within the black community that cannot be explained merely by racism or poverty - one of them being the breakdown of the black family.

This 5 minute video by Ben Shapiro sums up the deeper problem well:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4kbF7mvBWo&fbclid=IwAR0S2l5_u4-idHHAPRLksIRrhzhOBkKPWnPkaDGw2M9QsE94_AQaWc32qMk
« Last Edit: June 05, 2020, 08:11:15 PM by Tom Eckstein »
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Matt Staneck

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2020, 09:17:59 PM »
The gulf here is a debate between "racism is primarily personal" v. "racism is primarily institutional."

The evidence I share here is coming from the perspective that racism is primarily institutional: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/06/03/us/minneapolis-police-use-of-force.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage

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peter_speckhard

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Re: Candace Owens video. Thoughts?
« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2020, 09:36:13 PM »
The gulf here is a debate between "racism is primarily personal" v. "racism is primarily institutional."

The evidence I share here is coming from the perspective that racism is primarily institutional: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/06/03/us/minneapolis-police-use-of-force.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage

M. Staneck
There is no evidence of any kind in that article because the number of instances of police use of force is correlated only to population. The relevant statistic would correlate that number to the number of arrests/police interactions, and further correlated to number of uncooperative interactions. Otherwise you have to assume that the populations commit crimes, live in high crime areas, or cooperate with the police at the same rate, which is not true. The paper that employs Nate Silver has no excuse for publishing this kind of statistical analysis other than that it supports a narrative, especially since comprehensive crime statistics flatly contradict that narrative.