Author Topic: Coronavirus news  (Read 397986 times)

Michael Slusser

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3435 on: April 11, 2021, 07:41:51 PM »
Thank you for the suggestions and advice!

Peace,
Michael
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Charles Austin

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3436 on: April 11, 2021, 08:51:27 PM »
Peter writes:
Actually, vaccines have nothing to do with progressives or conservatives. But maybe in one more post you can make this thread about Trump, too.
I comment:
Oh? Chart those who are pushing hard for vaccination and those reluctant or who won’t take the vaccine. Tell me what you find. The former president is irrelevant.
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jebutler

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3437 on: April 11, 2021, 10:41:27 PM »
Peter writes:
Actually, vaccines have nothing to do with progressives or conservatives. But maybe in one more post you can make this thread about Trump, too.
I comment:
Oh? Chart those who are pushing hard for vaccination and those reluctant or who won’t take the vaccine. Tell me what you find. The former president is irrelevant.

According to NPR, 37% of Latinos, 28% of whites, and 25% of blacks are reluctant to get a vaccine.

The reasonings vary. Some blacks are worried due to things such as the Tuskagee experiments of the past.

Some believe there may be long term health issues. Some don't think there was enough experimentation. I got one of my members a J&J appointment yesterday. I asked him if his wife got vaxxed too. He said she did. He kinda hemmed and hawed and then I said, "So, she's waiting to see if you drop dead first, right?" He laughed and said, "Basically, yeah."

Others, seeing that Fauci says still wear masks, still distance, still etc. figure what's the use? If getting the vaccine won't change anything, why should I? I was visiting one of my elderly members in her retirement place before Easter. The entire staff has been vaxxed as have all the residents, yet they are still masked, things are still cancelled, and they are still dining alone. She wondered why they got the shots if nothing has changed. That makes people feel frustrated.

Along with that, Massachusetts is doing a good job of vaxxing (coming close to 1/3 of the state fully vaxxed) and yet there are still new cases, so why if it doesn't change anything? (That's a problem with only reporting numbers and not putting them into context nor saying how severe the cases are.) Then there are the few cases where people get COVID post vax, so once again, why do it?

Some may have listened to Kamala Harris before the election when she said she wouldn't take any Trump vaccine without realizing she was as serious about that as she was her accusation that Biden was racist.

Some might are worried about the microchips contained in the vaccine. I was concerned about that until they told me I could have it programmed to automatically upload all of my workouts to Strava; I was cool with that. (Hmmm. Maybe I better tell Charles that's a joke. Considering he thinks I'm using my name to make anonymous posts, rational thought obviously isn't one of his strong points.)

People have lots of reasons why they are reluctant. The good news is that, according to the AP, reluctance rates are falling and will probably continue to do so.
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Richard Johnson

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3438 on: April 11, 2021, 11:37:47 PM »
Peter writes:
Actually, vaccines have nothing to do with progressives or conservatives. But maybe in one more post you can make this thread about Trump, too.
I comment:
Oh? Chart those who are pushing hard for vaccination and those reluctant or who won’t take the vaccine. Tell me what you find. The former president is irrelevant.

I was talking with our county public health director at church today. He says that the anti-vaxers around here include both extreme right wing and extreme left wing folks. It's like a circle, he says, not a continuum; the two extremes end up in the same place.
The Rev. Richard O. Johnson, STS

J. Thomas Shelley

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3439 on: April 12, 2021, 12:30:47 AM »
Others, seeing that Fauci says still wear masks, still distance, still etc. figure what's the use? If getting the vaccine won't change anything, why should I? I was visiting one of my elderly members in her retirement place before Easter. The entire staff has been vaxxed as have all the residents, yet they are still masked, things are still cancelled, and they are still dining alone. She wondered why they got the shots if nothing has changed. That makes people feel frustrated.

For a year many politicians and prelates dangled the carrot of "when there is a vaccine" that allegedly there would be a return to some semblance of life as we knew it in February of 2020.

Now there is a vaccine; but in many jurisdictions (political and ecclesial) restrictions continue unabated, in some cases not only with no end in sight but not even an "exit plan" outlining what metrics must be attained before capacity limits and masking may be lifted.

"Frustration" may be too mild a word to describe the sense of betrayal, manipulation, and, in some cases, hopelessness felt by those who can perceive only a perpetual pandemic
« Last Edit: April 12, 2021, 12:50:43 AM by J. Thomas Shelley »
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Charles Austin

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3440 on: April 12, 2021, 03:26:59 AM »
If you thought the mere existence of a vaccine or even the widespread inoculations meant a return to "normal," you were not paying attention.
Masks will still be required, probably for another year.
Some distancing will be required, even though more "closeness" in some quarters will be safe.
Hand-washing will still be required.
Many gatherings - including church - might prove risky enough for some that they should not be held or that some people should not attend them.
Traveling will change.
These things have been known and told to us by the immunologists and medical authorities for the past year.
The vaccines work. But other precautions are necessary. Just like seat belts work; but you still take precautions to prevent a head-on crash.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2021, 03:42:13 AM by Charles Austin »
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James S. Rustad

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3441 on: April 12, 2021, 07:59:52 AM »
I am expecting that once most people are vaccinated that there will be a huge rebellion against the idea that we need to keep masking, social distancing, and everything else that was done to slow the spread of the virus.  Those who push the idea that we have to stay in full prevent mode are going to be ignored.  We'll then find out if the full prevent mode was still needed.

Charles Austin

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3442 on: April 12, 2021, 09:04:47 AM »
Nothing like “experimenting” with the actual lives of people. If wearing a mask “works”, we save lives. If wearing a mask is unnecessary, we experience a minor inconvenience. If we don’t wear masks and it turns out they are necessary, we lose lives.
Your choice.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2021, 09:12:07 AM by Charles Austin »
Retired ELCA pastor. Iowa born. Back home from Sioux City after three days and a pleasant reunion of the East High School class of - can you believe it! - 1959.

D. Engebretson

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3443 on: April 12, 2021, 09:37:14 AM »
I think that as we move into 'Year 2' of the pandemic we will see different reactions to the virus and how it impacts everyday life, but the majority will start moving back to where they were, if they haven't already.  If my observations are any indication, many people are now slowly moving their way back to a pre-pandemic lifestyle. As one example, in-person church attendance is clearly rising.  Easter was the highest yet, and the week after Easter maintained a higher-than-before attendance.  A few people remain at a distance from church, but that number is shrinking.  Our older members, by and large, are vaccinated, allowing that core group to return. Others who had COVID returned first.

Masks are worn, especially in the larger stores, and in church by some, not all, but I sense that their use is far less prevalent overall.  Rates are not showing any significant rise in my area, although clearly there are some areas of the country that are, but it is not the majority as it was in the midst of the pandemic.  They keep talking of a "Fourth Wave," but I think that it will not be nationwide, but rather pockets or areas that have spikes.  With the continued rapid vaccination of the nation we are, I believe, approaching a tipping point where the virus will not be a substantial threat.

The pandemic has changed behaviors for the long-term, however.  I think that some people will wear masks long, long after the pandemic has waned.  Some will allow themselves a little bit of freedom during part of the year, but will don them once 'flu season' starts in the fall.  Many are now clearly 'germaphobic,' and our fear of potentially infectious microbes will not only limit the way they live and the places they go, but will probably cause an increased resistance to common germs.  Note the effect that anti-bacterial soaps have had on killing even the 'good bacteria' we need to be healthy.

I think that a larger issue we will need to grapple with is how we handle risk.  Perhaps it is because I work in emergency response services I have a working 'comfort' with managed risk.  That means I assume some risk and some harm from what I do.  I cannot live in a bubble.  And neither can a nation. 
« Last Edit: April 12, 2021, 09:39:20 AM by D. Engebretson »
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J. Thomas Shelley

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JEdwards

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3445 on: April 12, 2021, 09:56:10 AM »
FWIW, I wrote this back in February at our pastor's request.  I think it's still generally applicable now, although we now have even more information to support the idea that vaccination reduces the risk of acquiring asymptomatic infection and spreading it.  Also, the decline that we saw in Ohio in February has leveled off.

Peace,
Jon

Finally, the end is in sight!  Thanks be to God, cases of coronavirus infection are on the decline locally and across the country.  With that in mind, I was happy to hear that Pastor Scott and lay leaders at Our Saviour are making plans to resume in-person worship.  Thanks to the scientific advances of the last year, we have more knowledge and tools to do so in a reasonably safe way.  However, the virus is still circulating, and we all have varying levels of risk based on our own health conditions and those of our family members.  In-person worship may not be the best decision for everyone, which is one reason why live-streaming of worship will continue.  This note is intended to share information to help each of us make decisions that promote safety for our family members and our brothers and sisters in Christ.
My first piece of advice:  get vaccinated as soon as you can!  I have read the peer-reviewed reports of the trials of the currently-available vaccines, and the efficacy and safety data are impressive.  Some level of protection is detectable about 12 days after the first dose.  By 7 days after the second dose, the vaccines are over 90% effective against severe disease.  Serious side effects of the vaccines are quite rare (severe allergic reactions have occurred in less than 0.001% of the people vaccinated so far).  My own experience was typical of what was reported in the clinical trials:  I had a sore shoulder for a few days after each vaccine dose, and I felt tired and had a slight headache for about a day after the second dose. 
While there is some evidence to suggest that vaccinated people are less likely to spread the virus, this is less certain.  In the clinical trials, a small number of vaccinated individuals were nevertheless found to be carrying the virus even though they didn’t feel sick.  Even if you have been vaccinated, it is important to follow all the recommended precautions – frequent hand washing, wearing masks, and observing social distancing – especially if you are in regular contact with vulnerable family members.  Likewise, if you have fever, cough, or other symptoms of coronavirus infection, please consider the safety of others, and participate in worship remotely – even if you have been vaccinated.
Both the chance of getting infected and the severity of the infection depend heavily on your age and other health conditions.  In Ohio, nearly half of all cases serious enough to result in hospitalization have occurred in people over the age of 70, and another 21% have occurred in people between the ages of 60 and 69.  People with COPD, heart disease, asthma, diabetes, and high blood pressure have a heightened risk of severe disease. 
Finally, while there was initially some conflicting guidance about the value of wearing masks, a series of scientific studies has found a clear link between the use of masks and a reduction in the spread of the virus.  I don’t think anyone enjoys wearing a mask, but this is still a key part of a responsible plan to allow us to gather together again and keep everyone safe.


peter_speckhard

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3446 on: April 12, 2021, 10:13:27 AM »
If you thought the mere existence of a vaccine or even the widespread inoculations meant a return to "normal," you were not paying attention.
Masks will still be required, probably for another year.
Some distancing will be required, even though more "closeness" in some quarters will be safe.
Hand-washing will still be required.
Many gatherings - including church - might prove risky enough for some that they should not be held or that some people should not attend them.
Traveling will change.
These things have been known and told to us by the immunologists and medical authorities for the past year.
The vaccines work. But other precautions are necessary. Just like seat belts work; but you still take precautions to prevent a head-on crash.
Required? By whom?

Charles Austin

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3447 on: April 12, 2021, 11:42:00 AM »
“Required“ by anyone with half a brain who has read the supporting information about the precautions.
And, like the requirement that we wear seatbelts when driving, certain precautions may be required by law.
Do you have a problem with seatbelts?

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D. Engebretson

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3448 on: April 12, 2021, 12:10:28 PM »
In my state (Wisconsin) there is no legal mandate from Madison to wear masks. The Supreme Court of the state struck down the governor's emergency executive order as overstepping his legal power to indefinitely extend such orders without legislative backing. Individual jurisdictions (e.g. cities) can enact such laws and rules, and businesses may require them, as many in my area still do. 

I am not an 'anti-masker' (and wear one quite frequently - a church and elsewhere), but fail to see the overall effectiveness in the way such a practice is carried out in the real world.  As one who is out and about in the major retail outlets on a daily basis, I see people with masks that are truly inadequate.  For one thing they don't fit and slide down and people are forever having to reposition them, thus touching them, something the 'experts' advised against.  Furthermore, I swear at least half the people I see wear masks conveniently wear them only over the mouth with their noses sticking out.  Can't see how that does any good.  Be just as good if they ditched the masks altogether.  The only mask that offers any real, substantial protection is an N-95 mask (or its cousin the KN95 one from China), that must be fitted for the user.  But I see very few of those, and the cloth ones are makeshift at best.

So whether masks are good or not, I struggle to see how in practice they are really accomplishing the purpose the CDC envisions.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2021, 12:12:36 PM by D. Engebretson »
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St. Peter Lutheran Church of Polar (Antigo) WI

Robert Johnson

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Re: Coronavirus news
« Reply #3449 on: April 12, 2021, 12:23:11 PM »
The only mask that offers any real, substantial protection is an N-95 mask (or its cousin the KN95 one from China), that must be fitted for the user.  But I see very few of those, and the cloth ones are makeshift at best.

I have a box of N95 masks that I bought for shop work. It's hard for me to wear one for long, because it leaves me short of breath. I suppose that's a by-product of the superior filtering.