Author Topic: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced  (Read 135623 times)

James J Eivan

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #15 on: January 18, 2020, 03:00:54 PM »
b. So, to your best recollection, Dr. Scholl has never served as a parish pastor?  Straight from vicarage to colloquy to seminary staff? 
It’s interesting the Dr. Scholl has served his entire ministry at Concordia Seminary, St. Louis and resides in Missouri ... but is a member of the Atlantic District. 
I realize that at times retired pastors remain members of the district in which they served which may be because they have more in common there than in the district they retired to.
What are the guidelines concerning active clergy members… And their membership in a district other than the local district in which they currently serve?
The district membership of the new pastor at the congregation I attend was dropped by his former DP immediately upon preaching his farewell sermon ... for a month he was rostered serving no congregation because vacation and other commitments delayed his installation at his new congregation.  Shouldn’t Dr. Scholl’s district membership be in the Missouri District where he lives and serves?

RevG

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2020, 03:04:45 PM »
FWIW, I think it would be helpful to clarify in these lists what kind of doctorate the nominee has, for example D.Min, Ph.D, Th. D or whatever. 

peter_speckhard

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #17 on: January 18, 2020, 03:23:47 PM »
b. So, to your best recollection, Dr. Scholl has never served as a parish pastor?  Straight from vicarage to colloquy to seminary staff? 
It’s interesting the Dr. Scholl has served his entire ministry at Concordia Seminary, St. Louis and resides in Missouri ... but is a member of the Atlantic District. 
I realize that at times retired pastors remain members of the district in which they served which may be because they have more in common there than in the district they retired to.
What are the guidelines concerning active clergy members… And their membership in a district other than the local district in which they currently serve?
The district membership of the new pastor at the congregation I attend was dropped by his former DP immediately upon preaching his farewell sermon ... for a month he was rostered serving no congregation because vacation and other commitments delayed his installation at his new congregation.  Shouldn’t Dr. Scholl’s district membership be in the Missouri District where he lives and serves?

I don’t have an answer, but it is a good question.

Mike in Pennsylvania

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #18 on: January 18, 2020, 03:25:24 PM »
I'm an outsider, but it would seem to me that the basic tasks of a seminary president are administration and fundraising.  For the former, parish experience, particularly in a larger parish, would be useful.  But neither task requires an advanced degree in a scholarly field.  Having such a degree may lend prestige, and perhaps credibility with the faculty, but does not make up for lacking the skill set for the basic tasks.  Neither would skill as a teacher qualify one for those tasks.  I think a seminary looking for a president, regardless of denomination, needs to keep this in mind.
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John_Hannah

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #19 on: January 18, 2020, 03:32:59 PM »
b. So, to your best recollection, Dr. Scholl has never served as a parish pastor?  Straight from vicarage to colloquy to seminary staff? 
It’s interesting the Dr. Scholl has served his entire ministry at Concordia Seminary, St. Louis and resides in Missouri ... but is a member of the Atlantic District. 
I realize that at times retired pastors remain members of the district in which they served which may be because they have more in common there than in the district they retired to.
What are the guidelines concerning active clergy members… And their membership in a district other than the local district in which they currently serve?
The district membership of the new pastor at the congregation I attend was dropped by his former DP immediately upon preaching his farewell sermon ... for a month he was rostered serving no congregation because vacation and other commitments delayed his installation at his new congregation.  Shouldn’t Dr. Scholl’s district membership be in the Missouri District where he lives and serves?

Synodical employees who are rostered are permitted to hold district membership in any of the 35 districts. (Just as are those retired.)
Pr. JOHN HANNAH, STS

Steven W Bohler

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #20 on: January 18, 2020, 04:05:33 PM »
FWIW, I think it would be helpful to clarify in these lists what kind of doctorate the nominee has, for example D.Min, Ph.D, Th. D or whatever.

I agree.  And, I would add, whether it was an earned or honorary doctorate.

Steven W Bohler

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #21 on: January 18, 2020, 04:06:22 PM »
b. So, to your best recollection, Dr. Scholl has never served as a parish pastor?  Straight from vicarage to colloquy to seminary staff? 
It’s interesting the Dr. Scholl has served his entire ministry at Concordia Seminary, St. Louis and resides in Missouri ... but is a member of the Atlantic District. 
I realize that at times retired pastors remain members of the district in which they served which may be because they have more in common there than in the district they retired to.
What are the guidelines concerning active clergy members… And their membership in a district other than the local district in which they currently serve?
The district membership of the new pastor at the congregation I attend was dropped by his former DP immediately upon preaching his farewell sermon ... for a month he was rostered serving no congregation because vacation and other commitments delayed his installation at his new congregation.  Shouldn’t Dr. Scholl’s district membership be in the Missouri District where he lives and serves?

Synodical employees who are rostered are permitted to hold district membership in any of the 35 districts. (Just as are those retired.)

Is there some Handbook reference for that?

John_Hannah

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #22 on: January 18, 2020, 04:31:14 PM »
b. So, to your best recollection, Dr. Scholl has never served as a parish pastor?  Straight from vicarage to colloquy to seminary staff? 
It’s interesting the Dr. Scholl has served his entire ministry at Concordia Seminary, St. Louis and resides in Missouri ... but is a member of the Atlantic District. 
I realize that at times retired pastors remain members of the district in which they served which may be because they have more in common there than in the district they retired to.
What are the guidelines concerning active clergy members… And their membership in a district other than the local district in which they currently serve?
The district membership of the new pastor at the congregation I attend was dropped by his former DP immediately upon preaching his farewell sermon ... for a month he was rostered serving no congregation because vacation and other commitments delayed his installation at his new congregation.  Shouldn’t Dr. Scholl’s district membership be in the Missouri District where he lives and serves?

Synodical employees who are rostered are permitted to hold district membership in any of the 35 districts. (Just as are those retired.)

Is there some Handbook reference for that?

There should be.   :)  Peace, JOHN
Pr. JOHN HANNAH, STS

Steven W Bohler

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #23 on: January 18, 2020, 05:20:23 PM »
b. So, to your best recollection, Dr. Scholl has never served as a parish pastor?  Straight from vicarage to colloquy to seminary staff? 
It’s interesting the Dr. Scholl has served his entire ministry at Concordia Seminary, St. Louis and resides in Missouri ... but is a member of the Atlantic District. 
I realize that at times retired pastors remain members of the district in which they served which may be because they have more in common there than in the district they retired to.
What are the guidelines concerning active clergy members… And their membership in a district other than the local district in which they currently serve?
The district membership of the new pastor at the congregation I attend was dropped by his former DP immediately upon preaching his farewell sermon ... for a month he was rostered serving no congregation because vacation and other commitments delayed his installation at his new congregation.  Shouldn’t Dr. Scholl’s district membership be in the Missouri District where he lives and serves?

Synodical employees who are rostered are permitted to hold district membership in any of the 35 districts. (Just as are those retired.)

Is there some Handbook reference for that?

There should be.   :)  Peace, JOHN

I am guessing it is this (assuming that the seminary qualifies as an "agency other than a district"):


2.12.1.5   An individual member of the Synod who is serving an agency other than a district and other than a missionary or chaplain serving under call by the Synod shall hold membership through the district designated by that person if approved by both the president of that district and the president of the district in which the agency is located, but shall be subject to the ecclesiastical supervision of the president of the geographical district in which the agency is located. When all voting members of the agency are members of a non-geographical district, membership shall be held through that district.


WHY a man serving in Missouri would seek to be a member of Atlantic District is another question, though....

John_Hannah

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #24 on: January 18, 2020, 05:29:41 PM »

WHY a man serving in Missouri would seek to be a member of Atlantic District is another question, though....


It is a great district. Why not?   :)

Peace, JOHN
Pr. JOHN HANNAH, STS

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #25 on: January 18, 2020, 05:45:57 PM »
I am guessing it is this (assuming that the seminary qualifies as an "agency other than a district"):

2.12.1.5   An individual member of the Synod who is serving an agency other than a district and other than a missionary or chaplain serving under call by the Synod shall hold membership through the district designated by that person if approved by both the president of that district and the president of the district in which the agency is located, but shall be subject to the ecclesiastical supervision of the president of the geographical district in which the agency is located. When all voting members of the agency are members of a non-geographical district, membership shall be held through that district.
The 2019 convention actually amended this provision so that it now reads as follows:

2.12.1.5   An individual member of the Synod serving in any other position shall hold membership through the geographical district in which the place of service is located, unless serving an agency or mission of a non-geographical district, in which case membership shall be held through that district.

Presumably this means that Synod members serving at Concordia Seminary must now be members of the Missouri District, and Synod members serving at Concordia Theological Seminary must now be members of the Indiana District.  This change may have been prompted by the Matthew Becker situation--he was on the faculty at Valparaiso University in Indiana, but still a member of the Northwest District from his time at Concordia University Portland.

WHY a man serving in Missouri would seek to be a member of Atlantic District is another question, though....
Especially since, even under the previous version, his ecclesiastical supervisor was the Missouri District President regardless.  From that standpoint, what did it even mean to be a "member" of another district?
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peter_speckhard

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #26 on: January 18, 2020, 05:53:14 PM »
I am guessing it is this (assuming that the seminary qualifies as an "agency other than a district"):

2.12.1.5   An individual member of the Synod who is serving an agency other than a district and other than a missionary or chaplain serving under call by the Synod shall hold membership through the district designated by that person if approved by both the president of that district and the president of the district in which the agency is located, but shall be subject to the ecclesiastical supervision of the president of the geographical district in which the agency is located. When all voting members of the agency are members of a non-geographical district, membership shall be held through that district.
The 2019 convention actually amended this provision so that it now reads as follows:

2.12.1.5   An individual member of the Synod serving in any other position shall hold membership through the geographical district in which the place of service is located, unless serving an agency or mission of a non-geographical district, in which case membership shall be held through that district.

Presumably this means that Synod members serving at Concordia Seminary must now be members of the Missouri District, and Synod members serving at Concordia Theological Seminary must now be members of the Indiana District.  This change may have been prompted by the Matthew Becker situation--he was on the faculty at Valparaiso University in Indiana, but still a member of the Northwest District from his time at Concordia University Portland.

WHY a man serving in Missouri would seek to be a member of Atlantic District is another question, though....
Especially since, even under the previous version, his ecclesiastical supervisor was the Missouri District President regardless.  From that standpoint, what did it even mean to be a "member" of another district?
Sounds like a ploy to avoid district conventions! And appointment to committees, and people nagging you to stand for some position! Not a member of Missouri, and easy excuse being so far from the Atlantic.

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2020, 06:19:49 PM »
Synodical employees who are rostered are permitted to hold district membership in any of the 35 districts. (Just as are those retired.)


I believe that in the ELCA, such non-parish positions, the clergy stay rostered in the synod from which they came. Where our synod and churchwide assemblies require 60% lay voting members, a synod that includes a college or seminary would be overrun with clergy types if they were all rostered in that synod. It also gives a greater sense that such institutions serve the whole church. At our synod assemblies when some of our rostered folks are a voting members who are serving California Lutheran University or Pacific Lutheran School of Theology, or one of our other colleges or seminaries, it connects us with them, and they with us.
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Dave Benke

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #28 on: January 18, 2020, 07:26:54 PM »
I am guessing it is this (assuming that the seminary qualifies as an "agency other than a district"):

2.12.1.5   An individual member of the Synod who is serving an agency other than a district and other than a missionary or chaplain serving under call by the Synod shall hold membership through the district designated by that person if approved by both the president of that district and the president of the district in which the agency is located, but shall be subject to the ecclesiastical supervision of the president of the geographical district in which the agency is located. When all voting members of the agency are members of a non-geographical district, membership shall be held through that district.
The 2019 convention actually amended this provision so that it now reads as follows:

2.12.1.5   An individual member of the Synod serving in any other position shall hold membership through the geographical district in which the place of service is located, unless serving an agency or mission of a non-geographical district, in which case membership shall be held through that district.

Presumably this means that Synod members serving at Concordia Seminary must now be members of the Missouri District, and Synod members serving at Concordia Theological Seminary must now be members of the Indiana District.  This change may have been prompted by the Matthew Becker situation--he was on the faculty at Valparaiso University in Indiana, but still a member of the Northwest District from his time at Concordia University Portland.

WHY a man serving in Missouri would seek to be a member of Atlantic District is another question, though....
Especially since, even under the previous version, his ecclesiastical supervisor was the Missouri District President regardless.  From that standpoint, what did it even mean to be a "member" of another district?

In other words, prior to the 2019 convention, it was possible for a professor to have membership in a "home" district, the district from which he came.  Which answers the prior question.
The way it gets played church-politically is that somebody's trying to pull a fast one.  In T. Scholl's case, he was at home in the Atlantic District.  That's all there was to it.  This is my recollection from five years ago when last I was in the supervisory role.

An issue for ecclesiastical supervision is that the President of the Missouri District now is saddled with supervision of way over a thousand clergy, when you count in all the emeritus who are still there plus the seminary faculty and the many congregations.  Absolutely non-manageable, especially given the percentage of hard and consumptive cases like restriction, suspension and conflict/clergy burnout and the like.

For example, another thing I remember from the old days is that when you leave the roster of the LCMS and want to get back on it, you have to go through the office of the district president of the district you left from.  This could be many years and many district presidents down the line.  That happened to me a few times, and was a) weird b) hard because of the amount of digging through old records required c) difficult because of the discernment involved in dealing with whatever the politics had been vs. what they now were to get down to the facts of the case.  So - imagine that if, as the bylaw now requires, you have 1500 clergy (whatever the number is exactly) under management, as in the Missouri District.  On second thought, don't imagine it.  It's just been created; give the Missouri District President time to get ready for that nervous breakdown.

Dave Benke


Steven W Bohler

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Re: Nominees for Concordia Seminary President Announced
« Reply #29 on: January 18, 2020, 08:16:06 PM »
Dr. Benke,

But prior to his seminary training at Yale -- according to Dr. Scholl's LinkedIn page -- Dr. Scholl worked for Concordia Seminary St. Louis for 2 1/2 years (as development officer), then Lutheran Hour Ministries for 4 1/3 years (as creative assistant to the speaker).  That would all be in Missouri.  Given his apparent age (from the photo on that LinkedIn page), I assume that is his entire post-college work experience.  It was posted on LutherQuest (by a man who claims to be a relative to Dr. Scholl) that Dr. Scholl was born/raised in Missouri.  So, his time in the Atlantic District was just his vicarage?  And he has been employed for 12+ years, ever since his colloquy, at CSL.  In Missouri.  Weird.  I would think that, sooner or later, he would have sought to have his district membership switched there, just for the sake of showing his intention to stay to the seminary.