Lutheran Seminary fires new president

[Dan Fienen]

Perhaps the presenters in question could lead a panel al discussion on worship sex and how to have happy, safe, God pleasing pre- post- and extra-marital sex.  Isn’t that what their manifesto is all about?

[Dan Fienen]

But I'm not sure it's a good idea to shield our children from all ideas, just because we have prejudged them to be terrible.

Your naïveté towards what our children are exposed to 24/7 on the playground; in the games and music they play; on the media the view via TV, films, and their devices; in their own families and the families of their friends and neighbors; and in the actions they are pressured to perform even in middle school is touching, Charles.  We like to speak of our church as offering an alternative.  We aren't.

Pax, Steven+

I’m remembering some twenty years ago a comment from a police officer at a presentation that at one time one way to detect if a child had been molested was that they had knowledge of the mechanics of sex beyond what was age appropriate.  Even at that time it was no longer the case, kids learned all that stuff from the internet, cable TV, movies, etc.

[Charles Austin]

Pastor Charlton again:
Before you mention transparency, ask yourself how transparent the planners of the Youth Gathering are being about Pastor Verma Rasche's ideas and language. 
I ask:
So are they hiding anything? Once a speaker’s name is out there, anyone anywhere can find out more than they really need to know about that speaker.
Apparently everyone will know in advance who the speakers are. How is that hiding anything?
And for what it’s worth, I could think of a bunch of people who I might rather have in front of our teenagers, but, you know?, Nobody asked me who I think should be there.

[DCharlton]

Pastor Charlton again:
Before you mention transparency, ask yourself how transparent the planners of the Youth Gathering are being about Pastor Verma Rasche's ideas and language. 
I ask:
So are they hiding anything? Once a speaker’s name is out there, anyone anywhere can find out more than they really need to know about that speaker.
Apparently everyone will know in advance who the speakers are. How is that hiding anything?
And for what it’s worth, I could think of a bunch of people who I might rather have in front of our teenagers, but, you know?, Nobody asked me who I think should be there.

Well then, I guess Doctor Latini wasn't hiding anything by leaving something off her CV.  Her name was out there, after all.  People should have googled her name.

I still don't understand the need for full disclosure and protection from dangerous ideas when it regards adults who are future pastors, but not when it regards minors who are entrusted to the church by their parents. 

[Charles Austin]

Tell me what is not being disclosed. On second thought, don’t.

[GalRevRedux]

Sorry not to have replied since my post a few pages back. Mr. Skogen was, in this instance, most upset about Pastor Rasche. Not Bolz-Weber, so much, this time.

Donna

[DCharlton]

Tell me what is not being disclosed. On second thought, don’t.

I'm not sure.  Maybe the promotional materials will tell us about her declaration that the ELCA is racist, her advocacy of extra-marital sex for pastors, and the name of her highly touted Advent devotional.  However, if not, then the planners are guilty of the same failure to disclose that doomed Dr. Latini's presidency.

[readselerttoo]

Pastor Charlton again:
Before you mention transparency, ask yourself how transparent the planners of the Youth Gathering are being about Pastor Verma Rasche's ideas and language. 
I ask:
So are they hiding anything? Once a speaker’s name is out there, anyone anywhere can find out more than they really need to know about that speaker.
Apparently everyone will know in advance who the speakers are. How is that hiding anything?
And for what it’s worth, I could think of a bunch of people who I might rather have in front of our teenagers, but, you know?, Nobody asked me who I think should be there.

Well then, I guess Doctor Latini wasn't hiding anything by leaving something off her CV.  Her name was out there, after all.  People should have googled her name.

I still don't understand the need for full disclosure and protection from dangerous ideas when it regards adults who are future pastors, but not when it regards minors who are entrusted to the church by their parents.

Heh.  Heh.   

[Dave Benke]

More on topic, if you haven't already viewed Acting President James Dunlop's talk in Gettysburg, here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGfJUxgO2-k.

Thanks for this - a humble opening speech centered on Luther's Small Catechism and the application of the 8th commandment and its meaning.  Among Lutherans of all stripes, and for all Christians, always a way to return to reconciliation through heartfelt conversation and mutual forgiveness in the Gospel.

Dave Benke

[Eileen Smith]

I’m looking on the gathering website and I can’t even find a list of speakers. Where did you guys find them?

There was a brouhaha recently on the NALC Clergy/Leaders Page on Facebook when Dan Skogen of “Exposing the ELCA” posted an article about one of the speakers. I suspect some of the “disturbing” information was gleaned from his site.

And before this gets too crazy, Mr. Skogen’s post and attitude were not well received in the group, and I believe the administrator removed the post, so I can’t quote it. I recall that one of the keynote speakers at the Gathering is one if the originators of the “F—k this S—t” devotional (sic) which was discussed at length in our forum.

Donna

I found it interesting that this was discussed on social media (and in person) over a week ago.  I was surprised that it did not appear on any church-related sites sooner.   I've yet to see one comment from an ELCA church youth leader or parent supporting the ELCA's choice of speaker.   A young teacher in our town suggested that parents would demand she be fired, much less speak to an assembly of kids.  I find it interesting that Trump's language causes us to have vapors yet we expect so much less from our pastors.   As one who sources speakers for our junior high schools in town on substance abuse, I dig deeply into the background of the motivational speakers we invite to our assemblies.   Is the language, the tattoos, the views on sexuality gimmicks used in the name of relevancy?  One of the instructors in the diakonia program once said, "We offer Christ's body and blood, we don't need gimmicks."  We should offer something better to our kids. 

[DeHall1]

OK. Found it. I assume what upsets Peter is Pastor Bolz-Weber.
Then you’ve got Steve Bouman, an outstanding speaker, a man who by the way grew up  in the Missouri Synod. And an Indian-American pastor.
So far, I’m not too upset. But you know me.
By the way, the Christmas and birthday present that beloved spouse and I gave to our 16-year-old grandson was enough money to attend the youth gathering. (We pay the costs, he pays the incidentals from his salary at the Pizza Ranch. )
And Skogen, The failed seminarian with an obsession, is a Particularly sad case.

I couldn't find the list of speakers at the youth gathering website -- I did find the two you've identified here on the youth gathering FB page, though....Would you mind posting a link to the website listing the speakers?  I'd like to see the complete list, and the youth gathering site is not the easiest to navigate.

TIA!

[Chuck]

Would you mind posting a link to the website listing the speakers?

https://www.elca.org/YouthGathering/details/mass-gathering#speakers

[mj4]

Wasn't Dr. Latini removed from her position later this past week?

Dave Benke

Yes. Her groveling proved insufficient.

And apparently United's groveling has proven insufficient for retaining the coveted RIC designation. From last week:

Our ULS community was informed on Tuesday [April 3rd] by ReconcilingWorks: Lutherans for Full Participation has suspended our Reconciling in Christ (RIC) designation. RIC status identifies an organization as being accepting of and encouraging the full participation of the LGBTQ community. This is deeply disappointing to the board and me, and I am sure to many others in our community. It is important to note that as ReconcilingWorks took its actions, ULS already had been taking steps to underscore its commitment to the LBGTQ community.

https://unitedlutheranseminary.edu/weekly-presidential-update-4-6/

[Jeremy Loesch]

Well, ULS had a good go. They tried hard but just couldn't make it. They can look fondly on their illustrious history of a few months and the many graduate they produced.

Their groveling was insufficient and now they get to wear therainbow B which will identify them as bigots for not being tolerant enough.

They should get a nice price for the sale of their two campuses. Lol

Jeremy

[Dan Fienen]

Wasn't Dr. Latini removed from her position later this past week?

Dave Benke

Yes. Her groveling proved insufficient.

And apparently United's groveling has proven insufficient for retaining the coveted RIC designation. From last week:

Our ULS community was informed on Tuesday [April 3rd] by ReconcilingWorks: Lutherans for Full Participation has suspended our Reconciling in Christ (RIC) designation. RIC status identifies an organization as being accepting of and encouraging the full participation of the LGBTQ community. This is deeply disappointing to the board and me, and I am sure to many others in our community. It is important to note that as ReconcilingWorks took its actions, ULS already had been taking steps to underscore its commitment to the LBGTQ community.

https://unitedlutheranseminary.edu/weekly-presidential-update-4-6/

Perhaps it would help the efforts with ReconcilingWorks to make it clear by words and actions that efforts to increase campus diversity and making ULS a welcoming place for all people emphatically does not include anyone who is not totally committed to full acceotance and participation of the LGBTQ community, and loyalty to that cause is a foundational principle for all that ULS teaches and does.  Perhaps a ceremonial hunt for reactionaries and their subsequent removal from and barring from campus would be a good symbolic gesture.


Just goes to show that the price of acceptance and the RIC merit badge is eternal vigilance against those whose tolerance is not pure enough.  Are you or have you ever been associated with an organization or group that is not totally intolerant of those who are not tolerant enough to completely and enthusiastically support the LGBTQ cause?


Intolerance in the name of tolerance is no vice.