Poll

Will you eat at Chick-fil-A today?

Yes
21 (32.8%)
No
14 (21.9%)
I would, but there is not a location near me.
29 (45.3%)

Total Members Voted: 42

Author Topic: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day  (Read 9971 times)

DCharlton

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #90 on: August 02, 2012, 08:48:57 PM »
And why are we extolling Mr. Cathy? He is not Lutheran. He is a fundamentalist Southern Baptist with a very narrow world view.

He doesn't believe in infant baptism which we as Lutherans uphold.

He doesn't believe in the Real Presence in the Lord's Supper which we as Lutherans uphold.

Most likely he is a "born again" Christian which abrogates all future sins whereas we Lutherans confess daily our sinful nature.

Please read Mr. Bergs' post just prior to yours, #89 I believe.  He gives the reasons that it matters to him as a former member of a Lutheran church. 

1.  He has personally experienced the same kind of treatment.

2.  The ELCA claims to consider it possible to be a good Lutheran Christian while not supporting same sex marriage, yet has passed on the opportunity to share the wisdom of one of it's social statements with the larger society.  (An opportunity that is seldom missed.)
David Charlton  

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George Erdner

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #91 on: August 02, 2012, 08:53:03 PM »
Buckeye Deaconess, please note that I used the word "probably" in my post about mistreated animals and so I am under no obligation to verify. It is a well known fact though that a huge proportion of animals used for our consumption do lead lives that are less than ideal. OK, you want to think that Mr. Cathy's chickens are happy birds, then go ahead, have a chicken sandwich on me.

And why are we extolling Mr. Cathy? He is not Lutheran. He is a fundamentalist Southern Baptist with a very narrow world view.

He doesn't believe in infant baptism which we as Lutherans uphold.

He doesn't believe in the Real Presence in the Lord's Supper which we as Lutherans uphold.

Most likely he is a "born again" Christian which abrogates all future sins whereas we Lutherans confess daily our sinful nature.

I guess it is OK that Mr. Cathy is the one who decides that the line is drawn between God's "wonderfully and fearfully made" creatures of "Us" versus "Them."

That's what I find disgusting.

Might he also be close-minded and judgemental? Or is that something Lutherans have a monopoly on.
 

Jim_Krauser

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #92 on: August 02, 2012, 09:03:39 PM »
The chicken guy believes in traditional heterosexual marriage.
But as a Baptist, I venture he doesn't believe in traditional (infant) baptism. 
 
Which of his affirmations/beliefs is more important/central to the Christan faith?

I didn't know that we were supposed to rank or prioritize different aspects of our faith. Are we supposed to judge and evaluate who we'll listen to by ranking their Christianness on some sort of numeric scale?
I just think that the whole hubbub here (and the support from staunch Lutherans) might be characterized by "strange bedfellows"  ;)
I suppose it might be another example of the adversary of my adversary is my friend.
 
Jim Krauser

Pastor-Grace Evang. Lutheran Church, North Bellmore, NY

Dave Likeness

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #93 on: August 02, 2012, 09:06:37 PM »
In the 2010 book entitled,
"The Lutheran Difference" and edited by Rev.
Edward Engelbrecht he states in the foreword,

"All who worship the Holy Trinity and trust in
Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins are
regarded by Lutherans as Christians despite
denominational or nondenominational
differences."

Mr. Cathy, Rev. Billy Graham, and Mother Teresa
should be considered Christians.  This is not a
bash the Baptists thread.  This is a thread that
rejoices in the fact that Christians can stand
together against the world's agenda of ripping
apart basic Christian beliefs like God's plan for
marriage between a man and a woman.

DCharlton

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #94 on: August 02, 2012, 09:32:35 PM »
The chicken guy believes in traditional heterosexual marriage.
But as a Baptist, I venture he doesn't believe in traditional (infant) baptism. 
 
Which of his affirmations/beliefs is more important/central to the Christan faith?

I didn't know that we were supposed to rank or prioritize different aspects of our faith. Are we supposed to judge and evaluate who we'll listen to by ranking their Christianness on some sort of numeric scale?
I just think that the whole hubbub here (and the support from staunch Lutherans) might be characterized by "strange bedfellows"  ;)
I suppose it might be another example of the adversary of my adversary is my friend.

No more strange than making common cause with people who despise religion and Christianity in particular.  Witness the ELCA's partnership with Dan Savage.  (Not to mention making common cause with a man who thinks rape might be just what some conservative legislators need.)
David Charlton  

Was Algul Siento a divinity school?

Buckeye Deaconess

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #95 on: August 02, 2012, 09:40:04 PM »
Having formerly been a member of the ELCA church, I state emphatically that I have more in common as an LCMS Lutheran with Southern Baptists than I do the ELCA on the whole (with the exception of some of you fine folks on here and others I've cooperated in the externals with).  They were a delight to work alongside of in my mission and human care work in the south.  Where we excel as Lutherans in those environments is our focus on the Gospel.  However, there was never a question of where they stood with respect to God's Word.  The same cannot be said about ELCA Lutherans as can be noted on this forum.

Wallenstein

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #96 on: August 02, 2012, 09:47:08 PM »
Buckeye Deaconess, please note that I used the word "probably" in my post about mistreated animals and so I am under no obligation to verify. It is a well known fact though that a huge proportion of animals used for our consumption do lead lives that are less than ideal. OK, you want to think that Mr. Cathy's chickens are happy birds, then go ahead, have a chicken sandwich on me.

And why are we extolling Mr. Cathy? He is not Lutheran. He is a fundamentalist Southern Baptist with a very narrow world view.


I suspect that you are a vegetarian.  Your claims align with those representing PETA.  One major weakness of PETA is the relentless bashing of people who eat meat.  People will continue to eat meat no matter how loud PETA screams at them to stop.  PETA would win more allies if it were to lobby for organic, small family farms, where animals are raised humanely.

I do understand PETA's position, but what does animal cruelty have to do with religious affiliation? :o :o :o

Buckeye Deaconess

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #97 on: August 02, 2012, 09:49:36 PM »
Buckeye Deaconess, please note that I used the word "probably" in my post about mistreated animals and so I am under no obligation to verify. It is a well known fact though that a huge proportion of animals used for our consumption do lead lives that are less than ideal. OK, you want to think that Mr. Cathy's chickens are happy birds, then go ahead, have a chicken sandwich on me.

And why are we extolling Mr. Cathy? He is not Lutheran. He is a fundamentalist Southern Baptist with a very narrow world view.

He doesn't believe in infant baptism which we as Lutherans uphold.

He doesn't believe in the Real Presence in the Lord's Supper which we as Lutherans uphold.

Most likely he is a "born again" Christian which abrogates all future sins whereas we Lutherans confess daily our sinful nature.

I guess it is OK that Mr. Cathy is the one who decides that the line is drawn between God's "wonderfully and fearfully made" creatures of "Us" versus "Them."

That's what I find disgusting.

My comment about verifying your facts mostly pertained to the specifics of the Chick-fil-A situation.  You got it wrong on all accounts, unfortunately, by pinning this on the CEO as well as making false assumptions about the motives of those on this board who chose to eat there yesterday.

Wow, you like that word "disgusting."  So we as Lutheran's don't "extol" non-Lutherans?  Truett Cathy is a successful businessman who chose to run his business according to his Biblically-based worldview.  If that is narrow, well, I submit Mt 7:13 to your reading.

I don't know your church affiliation, Mr. Martim, but as a former member of the ELCA, I have more in common with  Mr. Cathy than I do many Lutherans in that particular denomination.

Buckeye Deaconess

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #98 on: August 02, 2012, 09:59:38 PM »
For those of you interested (all others kindly ignore), here are a couple of more articles about yesterday's events.

Man fired for harrassing Chick-fil-A employee and posting video:
http://www.businessinsider.com/vante-cfo-bullies-chick-fil-a-worker-then-promptly-gets-fired-for-it-2012-8

Company posts record-setting sales:
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/chick-fil-record-setting-sales-appreciation-day/story?id=16912978#.UBsH-2t5mK1


Charles_Austin

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #99 on: August 02, 2012, 10:06:07 PM »
I'm beginning to think the whole thing was instigated by a chik-fil marketing guy. It would not have been hard to get the quote out there, drum up opposition and - voila! - record sales.

Buckeye Deaconess

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #100 on: August 02, 2012, 10:07:59 PM »
I must confess I'm not really sure what eating at or not eating at Chic fil la(?) will really accomplish.  This thread tends to fall into right-wing caricature whilst what started this whole thing - what the Boston and Chicago mayors did - also falls into left-wing caricature.  The driving force of this whole debate appears to be "my rights" whether left or right and I'm not so sure that plays out well with the proclamation of the Gospel.  Going to buy a sandwich at a fast food joint in "protest" doesn't necessarily bespeak Jesus' third way of love.  I think we American Christians are very good at taking the bait and then looking really bad.  Really, it's tit for tat with the 1st Amendment being the clear motivating point.  That's evidenced on this thread.  Yesterday someone posted a pic on Facebook of the drive thru line at a Chic fil la and in the line were mostly SUVs.  I just thought it was rather ironic, SUVs in line at a fast food joint.  Just kinda plays into the image of right wingers that has been propagated for years.  And what do people usually associate with the right wing in our country?  Christianity.

Peace,
Scott+

For the record, this thread was not intended to be about Gospel proclamation.  It was simply a way to gauge how other Lutherans felt about yesterday's events.

DCharlton

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #101 on: August 02, 2012, 10:18:23 PM »
I'm beginning to think the whole thing was instigated by a chik-fil marketing guy. It would not have been hard to get the quote out there, drum up opposition and - voila! - record sales.

I remember when Jerry Falwell called Ellen Degeneres "Ellen Degenerate."  I sort of rooted for her after that and was glad her career rebounded.   
David Charlton  

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George Erdner

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #102 on: August 02, 2012, 10:19:59 PM »
The chicken guy believes in traditional heterosexual marriage.
But as a Baptist, I venture he doesn't believe in traditional (infant) baptism. 
 
Which of his affirmations/beliefs is more important/central to the Christan faith?

I didn't know that we were supposed to rank or prioritize different aspects of our faith. Are we supposed to judge and evaluate who we'll listen to by ranking their Christianness on some sort of numeric scale?
I just think that the whole hubbub here (and the support from staunch Lutherans) might be characterized by "strange bedfellows"  ;)
I suppose it might be another example of the adversary of my adversary is my friend.

I didn't realize that Baptists were Lutherans' adversaries.
 

Bergs

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #103 on: August 02, 2012, 10:25:39 PM »
The chicken guy believes in traditional heterosexual marriage.
But as a Baptist, I venture he doesn't believe in traditional (infant) baptism. 
 
Which of his affirmations/beliefs is more important/central to the Christan faith?

I didn't know that we were supposed to rank or prioritize different aspects of our faith. Are we supposed to judge and evaluate who we'll listen to by ranking their Christianness on some sort of numeric scale?
I just think that the whole hubbub here (and the support from staunch Lutherans) might be characterized by "strange bedfellows"  ;)
I suppose it might be another example of the adversary of my adversary is my friend.

I didn't realize that Baptists were Lutherans' adversaries.

That reminded me of something.

http://www.elca.org/Who-We-Are/Our-Three-Expressions/Churchwide-Organization/Communication-Services/News/Releases.aspx?a=3478

Quote
In the action, the council declared that the ELCA "repudiates the use of governmental authorities to punish individuals or groups with whom it disagrees theologically."  It rejected the arguments of Martin Luther and Philip Melanchthon, two 16th century church reformers, "in which they hold that governmental authorities should punish Anabaptists for their teaching," the action said.

Hmmmm, interesting....

Brian J. Bergs
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But let me tell Thee that now, today, people are more persuaded than ever that they have perfect freedom, yet they have brought their freedom to us and laid it humbly at our feet. But that has been our doing.
The Grand Inquisitor

Scott6

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Re: Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day
« Reply #104 on: August 02, 2012, 10:48:15 PM »
Perhaps folks are smarter than we give them credit for.  Here's an article written by a 20 yr old gay man who can make the separation between a corporate exec having his free speech rights attacked and this somehow being about hating gay people.  While a number of distinctions he makes could still be sharpened in my mind, his overall point shows that folks are in fact capable of making distinctions, despite the spin that media outlets put out.