The Ordination of Women

[Donald_Kirchner]

You err, Rev. Austin, misconverting a particular proposition into a universal one.

Your conclusion, therefore, is logically invalid and, in fact, wrong. My focus was on relying on what feels (or looks or tastes) good as validation.

[peter_speckhard]

Gentlemen,
In support of my position I wish to ask the following: have you ever had your congregation walk out of your Church with most of them people smiling and feeling excited? That was how we felt after our first service with Pastor Bullock. When talking to a fellow member of our Congregation I mentioned that her sermon was "down to earth". He agreed with me.

Yes. In the first few months after a vacancy or turbulent time, it is so common as to be expected.

[Charles_Austin]

dgkirch writes:
You err, Rev. Austin, misconverting a particular proposition into a universal one.

I respond:
O.k., so every time I hear a women preach I am not hearing the snake, is that right? Can I get an "Amen!" on that? Or not?

[Donald_Kirchner]

You might even be hearing the Gospel!  

Just remember... Satan can validly baptize you.  

[Charles_Austin]

anybody else?

[peter_speckhard]

dgkirch writes:
You err, Rev. Austin, misconverting a particular proposition into a universal one.

I respond:
O.k., so every time I hear a women preach I am not hearing the snake, is that right? Can I get an "Amen!" on that? Or not?

Charles, your tedious use of absolutes like "every time" make you sound like a dolt. The point was clear to everyone else-- Eve felt good after being deceived, which means that a congregation feeling good after a sermon does not in and of itself mean a good sermon was preached. You are the one deliberately being a ruining the thread with your childish, faux misunderstandings.

[revklak]

Mark 16:15 -- I believe that throughout the gospels the Twelve/Eleven represent all believers.

Luke 9:1-6 -- Luke 10:1-12 involved many more than the Twelve in almost exactly the same kind of commission

If "throughout the gospels the Twelve/Eleven represent all believers," then how is it that "Luke 10:1-12 involved many more than the Twelve?"  Were the "many more" NOT believers?  Why have texts refering to "many more" or having to choose 12 from among all the disciples, if the 12 would simply represent all?

[Richard Johnson]

dgkirch writes:
You err, Rev. Austin, misconverting a particular proposition into a universal one.

I respond:
O.k., so every time I hear a women preach I am not hearing the snake, is that right? Can I get an "Amen!" on that? Or not?

No. But if you said "Not every time I hear a woman preach am I hearing the snake," then OK.

[revklak]

Gentlemen,
In support of my position I wish to ask the following: have you ever had your congregation walk out of your Church with most of them people smiling and feeling excited? That was how we felt after our first service with Pastor Bullock. When talking to a fellow member of our Congregation I mentioned that her sermon was "down to earth". He agreed with me.

ALL RIGHT -- before evyone continues to get off track  --- remember the thrust of the arguement is NOT whether someone can preach a sermon, deliver a message, read poetry, etc and makes it a satisfying experience to the hearers, but the question is AS FAR AS ECCLESIOLOGY IS CONCERNED  is it meet and right for ALL or any to do so?  Or in this case, women?

[Charles_Austin]

Peter writes:
You are the one deliberately being a ruining the thread with your childish, faux misunderstandings.

I comment:
So much for civil language. And you claim to know what I am "deliberately" trying to do? You claim my assertions are "faux"? And "childish"?

Garbage. It was clearly suggested that hearing a woman preach, one was hearing Satan. Not everyone - for which deo gratias - agrees. But it was said, and given the history of postings by certain folk here, that view is held.

But here's the deal. I'll back out of this discussion, not because I am not interested, but because - in the minds of most here - there is no discussion. Women pastors are wrong wrong wrong. We get that. Furthermore, according to Pastor Hess, women who do certain things that most women do today are corrupting the "order of creation" and the cause of society's ills.

Excuse me. I think I'll look for evidence of Noah's flood in my New Jersey back yard.

[Donald_Kirchner]

Garbage. It was clearly suggested that hearing a woman preach, one was hearing Satan...But it was said...

Rev. Austin,

I corrected you once, pointing out your illogical conclusion and then specifically stated that I was focusing on the danger in using feelings as validation. What better example than to look to the original fall into sin.

You now make the same erroneous misconversion of my proposition after being corrected and having it explained to you. You are now intentionally stating a falsehood.

Your statements clearly show us that a lie is not gender-specific, but please stop.

[peter_speckhard]

It was clearly suggested that hearing a woman preach, one was hearing Satan. Not everyone - for which deo gratias - agrees. But it was said, and given the history of postings by certain folk here, that view is held.

No such thing was ever suggested in this thread. 

[Charles_Austin]

dgkirch (after someone complimented a woman's sermon):
Well, Eve felt something similar, after talking to The Liar. "So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate, and she also gave some to her husband who was with her, and he ate." [Gen. 3:6] Perhaps she was even smiling and feeling excited.

Me:

[Donald_Kirchner]

Now you're simply being a bully, Rev. Austin. Please stop.

[Charles_Austin]

ok