Author Topic: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article  (Read 8577 times)

Richard Johnson

  • ALPB Administrator
  • ALPB Contribution Leader
  • *****
  • Posts: 10409
  • Create in me a clean heart, O God.
    • View Profile
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #60 on: November 12, 2010, 05:26:19 PM »

And yet, despite your geographic heritage, much of what you post is consistent with what is often described as an "East Coast Lutheran perspective". So, perhaps that particular label for that perspective is a misnomer.

I may be sorry for asking this, but exactly how would you characterize this "East Coast Lutheran perspective"?
The Rev. Richard O. Johnson, STS

George Erdner

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #61 on: November 12, 2010, 05:37:08 PM »

And yet, despite your geographic heritage, much of what you post is consistent with what is often described as an "East Coast Lutheran perspective". So, perhaps that particular label for that perspective is a misnomer.

I may be sorry for asking this, but exactly how would you characterize this "East Coast Lutheran perspective"?

Like this:

Exactly my point, George. And I certainly didn't miss Pr. Noland's East Coast connection; he knows what he is talking about in this regard.

I think East Coast Lutheranism is characterized by a certain social and theological liberalism and a strong interest in ecumenism along with a "high" evangelical catholic liturgical practice. Exceptions abound, and I'm sure several of you will take strong exception to my characterization.

I will say this: since living in New York and New Jersey I have been richly blessed by the liturgical practice of the LCMS churches that I have attended. My opinion of East Coast Lutheranism is certainly not all negative.

That sounds like a fair characterization, consistent with casual observation. In other words, close enough for rock and roll.

Dave Benke

  • ALPB Contribution Leader
  • *****
  • Posts: 12459
    • View Profile
    • Atlantic District, LCMS
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #62 on: November 12, 2010, 05:37:58 PM »

And yet, despite your geographic heritage, much of what you post is consistent with what is often described as an "East Coast Lutheran perspective". So, perhaps that particular label for that perspective is a misnomer.

I may be sorry for asking this, but exactly how would you characterize this "East Coast Lutheran perspective"?

The correct perspective.

Dave Benke

Scott6

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #63 on: November 12, 2010, 05:40:37 PM »
Uh, I'm not sure Michigan is the midwest. You can't be midwest if you've got Detroit.

Huh?  Why not?

I don't think the existence of urban blight restricts one to East Coast locales like NJ...  ;)

Daniel L. Gard

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #64 on: November 12, 2010, 05:42:03 PM »
I may be sorry for asking this, but exactly how would you characterize this "East Coast Lutheran perspective"?

Easy. Dave Benke. ;D

Scott6

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #65 on: November 12, 2010, 05:43:45 PM »

And yet, despite your geographic heritage, much of what you post is consistent with what is often described as an "East Coast Lutheran perspective". So, perhaps that particular label for that perspective is a misnomer.

I may be sorry for asking this, but exactly how would you characterize this "East Coast Lutheran perspective"?

The correct perspective.

Dave Benke

Yes, yes.  Of course.  *pats hand gently*

pr dtp

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #66 on: November 12, 2010, 05:51:26 PM »

And yet, despite your geographic heritage, much of what you post is consistent with what is often described as an "East Coast Lutheran perspective". So, perhaps that particular label for that perspective is a misnomer.

I may be sorry for asking this, but exactly how would you characterize this "East Coast Lutheran perspective"?

The correct perspective.

Dave Benke

I would agree - as long as you aren't south of Boston...

grabau14

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #67 on: November 12, 2010, 06:30:26 PM »
As a Baltimore boy living in Wisconsin, the best way to describe East Coast Lutheranism (LCMS) is liturgical, sacramental, "progessive" with regard to the service of women in the Divine Service, an openness to Darwin's theory of evolution, and open communion.  Not all fit into that sterotype.   

pr dtp

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #68 on: November 12, 2010, 06:35:52 PM »
As a Baltimore boy living in Wisconsin, the best way to describe East Coast Lutheranism (LCMS) is liturgical, sacramental, "progessive" with regard to the service of women in the Divine Service, an openness to Darwin's theory of evolution, and open communion.  Not all fit into that sterotype.   

Did you enjoy the game last night - while dreaming up such stereotypes?

Richard Johnson

  • ALPB Administrator
  • ALPB Contribution Leader
  • *****
  • Posts: 10409
  • Create in me a clean heart, O God.
    • View Profile
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #69 on: November 12, 2010, 07:42:26 PM »
As a Baltimore boy living in Wisconsin, the best way to describe East Coast Lutheranism (LCMS) is liturgical, sacramental, "progessive" with regard to the service of women in the Divine Service, an openness to Darwin's theory of evolution, and open communion.  Not all fit into that sterotype.   

OK, then, I'll mostly cop to that (with some caveats related to Darwin), even if I'll continue to resist the descriptor "East Coast."  ;D
The Rev. Richard O. Johnson, STS

Daniel L. Gard

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #70 on: November 12, 2010, 08:00:44 PM »
As a Baltimore boy living in Wisconsin, the best way to describe East Coast Lutheranism (LCMS) is liturgical, sacramental, "progessive" with regard to the service of women in the Divine Service, an openness to Darwin's theory of evolution, and open communion.  Not all fit into that sterotype.   

Did you enjoy the game last night - while dreaming up such stereotypes?

Actually, he did not dream up such stereotypes. These are common perceptions of the East Coast - indeed, of all "saltwater districts." What makes them unfair is that they are stereotypes and not necessarily grounded in reality. I know some who fit the stereotype and others who do not. In fact, Pr. Uttenreither said as much, "Not all fit the stereotypes."

Weedon

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #71 on: November 12, 2010, 09:03:44 PM »
As I've observed before:  the thing about stereotypes is that they are often, but not invariably, true.  Certainly as I was raised in a parish in MD, the practice was wide-open communion (all baptized Christians encouraged to commune), women serving as elders and so assisting with distribution and reading the lessons, evolution was not disputed at all, and the service was more or less liturgical.  We got LBW when it came out.  We even did a joint confirmation experience with the local Roman parish over on New Hampshire Ave.  That was back in the 70's. 

James_Gale

  • ALPB Contribution Leader
  • *****
  • Posts: 4082
    • View Profile
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #72 on: November 12, 2010, 09:36:02 PM »
And now we see that this is not just about geography.  I don't think you'll find many people raised in the LCA/ALC/ELCA who spend too much time worrying about Darwin, let alone stereotyping others regarding how they might react to his theories.  By contrast, I gather that this is an issue within Missouri.

By the way, if anyone thinks that inviting all baptized Christians to commune is wide-open communion, they haven't seen wide-open communion.

Dave_Poedel

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #73 on: November 12, 2010, 10:04:09 PM »
All right you geographical snobs!  All of the smart Lutherans from the Midwest have relocated to the desert Southwest, where we have the most amazing amalgamation of Lutherans, mixed with a lack of fear of Roman Catholics, mixed with an attitude that says "I did my duty back in _______, now just leave me alone and let me come to Church when I like".  Also, either a rabid loyalty to Synod or a "we're in the West and we'll do things the way we want to here" that confuses the uninitiated and causes a smile on those who know.....I have served my entire ministry here, I know better than to take a Call to the Midwest, and plan to minister here until the Lord calls me home.  I love it!

Daniel L. Gard

  • Guest
Re: Steadfast Lutherans Reflection On Lutheran Forum Article
« Reply #74 on: November 12, 2010, 10:05:32 PM »
And now we see that this is not just about geography.  I don't think you'll find many people raised in the LCA/ALC/ELCA who spend too much time worrying about Darwin, let alone stereotyping others regarding how they might react to his theories.  By contrast, I gather that this is an issue within Missouri.

By the way, if anyone thinks that inviting all baptized Christians to commune is wide-open communion, they haven't seen wide-open communion.

An interesting observation. As a former member of the LCA with many ELCA friends and relatives, I can assure you that stereotyping of Missouri is quite common. The is particularly so in regard to Darwinism - because I reject evolution, I am told that I am a fundamentalist, a Bible-thumper and several other names as well. Why? Well, I suspect sterotyping might have something to do with it. In fact, everything to do with it.

The problem with a term like "open communion" is that the meaning shifts depending on who is using it. The Missouri use of the term would certainly include what you describe. I suspose that for the ELCA, inviting all baptized Christians is hardly thought of as open communion at all.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2010, 09:42:28 AM by Daniel L. Gard »