Author Topic: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...  (Read 36602 times)

Mike Gehlhausen

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #165 on: July 14, 2010, 05:36:10 PM »
No, I am not a delegate. Just hanging around on my own dime since neither the Synod nor the Seminary wants to fund me. They would not even give Carl Fickenscher or me a name tag of any kind. This afternoon I am on-line in my room relaxing and following the elections via live-feed.

Man, how crazy is that?  Candidates for synodical president, and they won't even grant you guys credentials?

I'm actually wondering whether since Rev. Harrison is not a DP or delegate if he was issued a nametag.  Wouldn't it be rich if he was not?

Mike

Tim Boerger

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #166 on: July 14, 2010, 06:09:59 PM »
To return to an earlier discussion...

It would be an error to try to say that there was some "well organized movement" only for one of the candidates.

I'm just thinking "out loud" (on-line?) here, so take this for what it's worth (i.e., not much) but I wonder if the best explanation for the apparent discrepancy between the restructuring and presidential votes might be that there were, in fact, two relatively organized campaigns and that they both succeeded (at least partially).  The Praesidium and its supporters put on a full-court press in favor of the Task Force Proposals (which many people assumed would go hand-in-hand with PK's reelection).  At the same time, the opposition was campaigning primarily for the election of Matt Harrison (with the secondary hope of defeating the Task Force proposals).  I suspect that what happened was that a significant minority of the delegates were convinced by both campaigns (at least with regards to their primary objectives), while (consciously or not) rejecting the logic by which both campaigns linked the presidential election and the structural changes.  In other words, each campaign convinced a majority of delegates, which was possible because the campaigns weren't entirely symmetrical.

ptmccain

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #167 on: July 14, 2010, 06:14:14 PM »
Executives of program boards, agencies and entities are automatically advisory delegates to conventions.


Tim Boerger

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #168 on: July 14, 2010, 06:20:19 PM »
Executives of program boards, agencies and entities are automatically advisory delegates to conventions.


Am I right in thinking that there was a relatively recent reduction in the number of advisory delegates, or did I just make that up?

Keith Falk

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #169 on: July 14, 2010, 06:21:14 PM »
For those of us scoring at home who are not LCMS... what is the "United List"?  I thought I was up on the lingo in the various camps, but that's a new one for me.
Rev. Keith Falk, STS

Tim Boerger

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #170 on: July 14, 2010, 06:23:24 PM »
For those of us scoring at home who are not LCMS... what is the "United List"?  I thought I was up on the lingo in the various camps, but that's a new one for me.

http://theunitedlist.org/about/

Scott6

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #171 on: July 14, 2010, 06:28:17 PM »
For those of us scoring at home who are not LCMS... what is the "United List"?  I thought I was up on the lingo in the various camps, but that's a new one for me.

It's the one widely associated with the more "conservative" side of the LCMS.

tajennings

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #172 on: July 14, 2010, 06:50:48 PM »
I'm just thinking "out loud" (on-line?) here, so take this for what it's worth (i.e., not much) but I wonder if the best explanation for the apparent discrepancy between the restructuring and presidential votes might be that there were, in fact, two relatively organized campaigns and that they both succeeded...

Here's another theory or two.  When my congregation discussed nominations for SP, it wasn't about theology.  It was concerns over the stewardship and (lack of) transparency of the current administration vs the affinity they already had toward WR/HC and its leadership.  We nominated both Harrison and a moderate, but not PK.

I've also met folks on the moderate/progressive end who had worked on HC projects.  There is lot of good will toward Harrison by those who aren't involved with the theological battles.  And, the JF letter against HC stewardship provided a way for the WR/HC story to reach the delegates (3-page reponse letter) who had not bothered reading the board's report.

So there was an element of voting confidence/no confidence at both the leadership level and between the initiatives of WR/HC vs WM since the choice of president might decide whether HC projects or Ablaze! had more influence in the new mission boards.

We're probably thinking much more deeply about this than the delegates.  :D

Eileen Smith

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #173 on: July 14, 2010, 07:30:54 PM »
I've been a member of the ELCA for about 15 years, prior to that I was in the LCMS.  As one pastor once said, the LCMS is always in your heart.  So, I hope you won't mind a quick reflection here as I wasn't sure where else to share it.  Several days after 9/11, President Kieshnick joined with Bishop Anderson, Bishop Bouman and President Benke in New York.  They went down to Ground Zero - still smoldering - still looking for survivors and one could see how deeply he was moved - how this visit impacted him.  We all joined in a church in upper Manhattan and President Kieschnick brought comfort to all who were gathered. We prayed and we sang. We were all well beyond judicatories in our grief - simply there to comfort and be comforted.  I am grateful for the ministry of President Kieschnik that day as well as the other leaders who were with us and I pray that as he now is called to serve in a new way, God will grant him healing so that he might continue to be a blessing to others. 

Thank you very much for the commentary, Scott. You are doing a great job of giving us a glimpse into the happenings in Houston. 

peter_speckhard

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #174 on: July 14, 2010, 08:41:58 PM »
I remember all these elections in 2007 (literally all, with only one exception I can think of--Wohlrabe for 3rd veep) going to the JesusFirst list candidates, but often by slim margins. If you looked at percentages in the elections, it seemed as though the synod were relatively evenly divided, but if you looked simlpy at Ws and Ls, it was a massive landslide for JesusFirst last time around. I think there might be a tendency for delegates to be chosen primarily for whom they will vote for for SP, and then natural "coattails" for the winning SP, since the delegates, not knowing most of the other candidates particularly well, go with the lists their main candidate was on. That would also explain why the votes on specific issues don't necessarily go the way you'd predict based on the winning candidate's position. The elections function entirely separately from the other issues.

Mike Gehlhausen

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #175 on: July 14, 2010, 09:10:27 PM »
I remember all these elections in 2007 (literally all, with only one exception I can think of--Wohlrabe for 3rd veep) going to the JesusFirst list candidates, but often by slim margins. If you looked at percentages in the elections, it seemed as though the synod were relatively evenly divided, but if you looked simlpy at Ws and Ls, it was a massive landslide for JesusFirst last time around. I think there might be a tendency for delegates to be chosen primarily for whom they will vote for for SP, and then natural "coattails" for the winning SP, since the delegates, not knowing most of the other candidates particularly well, go with the lists their main candidate was on. That would also explain why the votes on specific issues don't necessarily go the way you'd predict based on the winning candidate's position. The elections function entirely separately from the other issues.

Makes sense to me.

Resonates a bit with the "give the SP a team he can work with" logic as well.

Mike

Scott6

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #176 on: July 15, 2010, 05:18:56 PM »
Question re: bylaws having to do with no one being able to serve two different elected offices at the same time.

Apparently, if someone is elected to 2 offices, then he'd have to decline one.  How the vacancy left would be filled is currently an open question.

PK -- Rules that we go ahead.

<So far, still no answer to what would happen w/ a vacancy>

Weedon

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #177 on: July 15, 2010, 10:30:19 PM »
I think it fair to say that the elections are tilting the same way as the Presidential election went.  Interesting, to say the least.  But I'm happy to see that the votes do not simply follow any of the handy little voter sheets (not knocking them, mind you; I use one myself - as a guide, not a law).  The delegates clearly have a mind of their own and exercise it at some surprising junctures.

Jeff-MN

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #178 on: July 15, 2010, 10:37:10 PM »
Has anyone seen any vote results for President of Synod by clergy vs. laity?  Was the vote for Harrison from the clergy vote and from the laity vote both approx. 54%?

Weedon

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Re: Elections -- Presidential and Otherwise...
« Reply #179 on: July 15, 2010, 10:42:43 PM »
Perhaps the election company knows that; but I'm sure no one else could have that information.