Messages

1

Your Turn / Re: Here's a Way to Control Guns

« on: Today at 06:44:35 AM »

If only the "control others to bow the knee to my worldview" crusaders were as enthusiastic about improving all areas of safety as they are about eliminating scary looking pieces of steel and plastic. 

Fentanyl deaths/day - about 150
https://www.cdc.gov/stopoverdose/fentanyl/index.html

Gun homicides and suicides deaths/day - about 130
https://www.thetrace.org/2022/12/gun-violence-deaths-statistics-america/

Violent crimes/day - about 3288

Concealed-carry homicides/day - about 0.15

According to the data, America’s 18 million concealed-carry permit holders accounted for 801 firearm-related homicides over a 15-year span, which amounts to roughly 0.7% of all firearm-related homicides during that time.

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Your Turn / Re: Here's a Way to Control Guns

« on: Yesterday at 07:39:29 PM »

The United States is 3rd in murders throughout the world.
If you remove
#1- Chicago
#2- Detroit
#3-Washington DC
#4-St Louis
#5-New Orleans the United States is then
189th out of 193 countries in the entire world.
PS-
All 5x Cities have STRICT Gun Control Laws.
Note which party leads each city.

3

Your Turn / Re: Jews and God(s)?

« on: March 25, 2023, 05:29:54 PM »

Dave Likeness writes:
Genesis 1:26 has been traditionally acknowledged by Christians as a reference to the Triune God.  "Let US make" refers to God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.

I muse:
When I say “let’s (contraction of ‘let us’) go to dinner”, am I a Trinity? Then there is the royal “we”. No clue, I see in who the “us” is.

Brian, I fear for your soul if that is your belief.

And CA.   

However, there is always hope.

4

Your Turn / Re: Valpo President/Board Decide to Sell Art Masterpieces to Pay for Dorm Renovation

« on: March 17, 2023, 12:54:30 PM »

This is one area in which Lutheran theology can provide insight valuable even in our secular society. Specifically, I'm referring to our concept of the sinner/saint and Paul's insights into our sinful condition, especially in Romans 7-8. We like to think of people as being either good or bad. It produces a severe case cognitive dissonance to recognize that people, all people, me included, people I admire or abhor included, are both good and bad. It is much more comfortable when considering people that we consider to be bad to ignore any good aspect and focus on them being entirely bad. Which means that when people have done things that we consider evil, then any good aspects must be dismissed from consideration. And people that we want to consider good, including ourselves, we must ignore or explain away any bad aspects of their character or actions.


That people like James Madison, Thomas Jefferson, George Washington did such noble things, wrote and fought for freedom and liberty, and still participated in chattel slavery produces cognitive dissonance. How could they be good guys and still do bad things? They were sinner/saints. As are we.


We also see this kind of either all good or all bad mentality when considering the George Floyd and January 6 rioters. Depending on our political alliances and who we root for, there is a distinct tendency to down play, justify, and excuse the violence of the group that we sympathize with while casting those whom we find unsympathetic as unremittingly evil.

Contemporary society is currently going through another perfectionistic phase where our heroes must be absolutely pure, and our villains must be unrelentingly evil. Real people are not like that, but we have a hard time dealing with that and tend to employ the procrustean solution.

Pastor Fienen, you just aren’t sufficiently woke. The Saint and Sinner trope is so old fashioned, back at the Reformation time or more. Get with the progressives, the modernistas, maybe go to “her church” with Charles and see what you can be. Don’t stay in the light any longer, the darkness awaits you too.

5

Your Turn / Re: Institutional Trust

« on: March 16, 2023, 02:56:19 PM »

Speaking of institutional trust, I was sorry to see ghp leave. Too bad that bad behavior is only selectively addressed on this forum and many of the polite caring for others types rarely participate anymore or chose to leave. Ravenous wolf gets another one, lambs steadily decreasing. Sad.

6

Your Turn / Re: Rolling Stone Magazine Article About LCMS LC Controversy

« on: March 13, 2023, 09:24:11 AM »

Brian, I'm pretty sure the German state church against which Bonhoeffer started the Confessing Church could have affirmed all those things, too. It doesn't matter if you agree on an authority if you don't agree with what it says. You're like a Catholic who recognizes a different pope insisting he has no differences with other Catholics; they agree on everything, including the legitimacy, authority, and primacy of the pope, but happen to have different opinions on who the pope is.

But here is an easy solution. If our differences are not church dividing, but you're the enlightened ones who see that and we're the weaker brother, then join us. Gay marriage is not church-dividing-- so give it up for the sake of not dividing the church!

It seems to be you're insisting on a divided church every bit as much as we are. The difference is that we acknowledge divisions of the church over things we acknowledge are church-dividing, and you acknowledge divisions over things you say are not church-dividing, which means your insistence on doing things as you see fit regardless of others' objections is an act of pure selfishness.

Worship of the creature and creation rather than worship of the Creator seems very, very dangerous. In fact very poisonous, bitten by the serpent. Fortunately there is a medicine for the repenting believer in Christ and His promises. Lord help my unbelief might be a good prayer.

7

Your Turn / Re: Rolling Stone Magazine Article About LCMS LC Controversy

« on: March 12, 2023, 05:10:04 PM »

Give me a break, Pastor Preus.  I raise serious questions and you nitpick quick-typed grammar? In context, it was clear I meant “we who are ecumenicals,” that last word meaning our outlook, not our profession.
I ask again. I ask you; I ask other Missourians who might not be in harmony with you: Does endorsing ordained women take one out of your “faith delivered to the saints”? Does same sex marriage? Does communing with Presbyterians? Does going into a ROTFLMAO mode when someone mentions a literal Genesis creation? Does questioning the Mosaic authorship of the Pentateuch?

Two comments:
1. I sincerely hope your heart monitor does not reveal serious problems.  I hope you feel better soon and recover completely from what ever your issues may be. 
2. Repentance is a gift from God.  Unrepentant behaviors such as you describe that are in direct conflict with Scriptural teaching throughout the ages are, in my opinion an extremely serious problem, as I understand God's Word.  I hope that God will grant repentance to all those who are currently unrepentant and practice or endorse those behaviors you mention.

God's blessings.

8

Your Turn / Re: truth = what we believe is true from our perspective

« on: March 11, 2023, 02:27:28 PM »

Do you believe that we are more knowledgeable than the generations who have gone before us?

Of course not.  We don't have "more knowledge," or "better knowledge," or "advanced knowledge."  We just have "different knowledge."  Isn't that right?

Tom Pearson

Yes.

9

Your Turn / Re: Megan Rohrer sues ELCA

« on: March 04, 2023, 03:49:19 PM »

Outside of your tribe, Pastor Preus, how does your condescension and scorn work in building up the body of Christ?

Talk about insulting, pot kettle darkness vs light!  You da man!

10

Your Turn / Re: Concordia College New York To Close At End of Academic Year

« on: March 04, 2023, 05:46:35 AM »

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pP3LkQCNYBY

I’m reminded of this.

11

Your Turn / Re: Concordia College New York To Close At End of Academic Year

« on: March 03, 2023, 06:03:42 PM »

This is twice in this thread you have avoided answering my direct questions?  Why?

Because you make a false assumption. It's like the question: "Have you stopped beating your wife?"
When I say, "I've never beat my wife," then you accuse me of not answering your question.

To put it plainly, I don't buy your assumption that there was no biblical basis for the change.

It was clear in our Social Statement, that there was not consensus on the interpretation of biblical texts.

So this is a bogus ELCA source?

https://learn.elca.org/jle/conscience-bound-beliefs-rule-and-the-conscience-bound-belief-rule/

12

Your Turn / Re: Concordia College New York To Close At End of Academic Year

« on: March 03, 2023, 04:27:52 PM »

Finlandia follows that of Dana College in the ELCA. Both were colleges founded and named by their ethnic groups. Dana founded by 1884 by Danes and Finlandia (Suomi) in 1896 by Finns. Dana closed in 2010. Financial debt, inability to attract more students and investors (especially after the crash in 2009) made it impossible to continue.

Are you referring to the US economic crash or the ELCA theological crash?

For the most part college-aged kids in the ELCA had no problem with the change in theology. When our discussions started on this in the 90s, I asked my sons (teenagers at the time) if this was an issue with kids their age. They both said, "No." Homosexual relationships was a non-issue for them and most of their peers.

Did you explain to your sons there was no Biblical basis for the change in theology?  If so, what did they say?  If not, why not?

https://learn.elca.org/jle/conscience-bound-beliefs-rule-and-the-conscience-bound-belief-rule/

Many of us believe that there was a biblical basis for the change in practice. Our theology didn't change. Sinners are still saved by God's grace through Jesus Christ. All of the clergy who are ordained are and remain sinners even after they are forgiven.

This is twice in this thread you have avoided answering my direct questions?  Why?

13

Your Turn / Re: Concordia College New York To Close At End of Academic Year

« on: March 03, 2023, 04:07:29 PM »

Finlandia follows that of Dana College in the ELCA. Both were colleges founded and named by their ethnic groups. Dana founded by 1884 by Danes and Finlandia (Suomi) in 1896 by Finns. Dana closed in 2010. Financial debt, inability to attract more students and investors (especially after the crash in 2009) made it impossible to continue.

Are you referring to the US economic crash or the ELCA theological crash?

For the most part college-aged kids in the ELCA had no problem with the change in theology. When our discussions started on this in the 90s, I asked my sons (teenagers at the time) if this was an issue with kids their age. They both said, "No." Homosexual relationships was a non-issue for them and most of their peers.

Did you explain to your sons there was no Biblical basis for the change in theology?  If so, what did they say?  If not, why not?

https://learn.elca.org/jle/conscience-bound-beliefs-rule-and-the-conscience-bound-belief-rule/

14

Your Turn / Re: Concordia College New York To Close At End of Academic Year

« on: March 03, 2023, 02:40:59 PM »

Finlandia follows that of Dana College in the ELCA. Both were colleges founded and named by their ethnic groups. Dana founded by 1884 by Danes and Finlandia (Suomi) in 1896 by Finns. Dana closed in 2010. Financial debt, inability to attract more students and investors (especially after the crash in 2009) made it impossible to continue.

Are you referring to the US economic crash or the ELCA theological crash?

15

Your Turn / Re: A Public Letter from President Harrison Regarding the "alt-right"

« on: March 02, 2023, 07:06:02 AM »

Pardon me, but I don’t see the connection between these recent posts and the thread title.